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VIC Circuit

Yes this is Priceless Rare Data of Stanley A Meyer and Knowledge suggest you back up all of it immediately  and share it to others. 

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Vic PCB has many mini circuits on it.

Here we start to detail them

Stanley A Meyer Vic Voltage Intensifier
Stanley A Meyer VIC PCB  Guide DIY Bbuild Science

01kV VIC Driver with mV sensitivity 

Stanley A Meyer VIC PCB  Board pin

Note the Gate  volt does not go to 0 volts, 4 tone nested amplitude gating

Hard Wired 2 in 1 

WhatsApp Image 2021-01-10 at 17.51.09.jp
Stanley A Meyer Analog Voltage Control T
Stanley A Meyer Analog Voltage Control.J

I completed most of the testing of the my build of the Analog Voltage Control Circuit (K9).  Only thing missing is the finally amplifier in the circuit which I have not received yet.  I decided to post this now as I plan on moving on to another circuit and do not expect this Q4 amplifier to change the wave train shape.  I attached the analysis and scope shots of signal as it passes through the circuit. I also attached a picture of the test setup which shows Freq Generation card K2, and Analog Voltage Generation card K8 which I used to test K9.  The scope shot shows the output from the card. This is also included in the report.  Note: Green LED on K9 is just a layout place holder for Q4.  Q4 most like will be mounted on an external Heat Sink due to it size and I believe is actually with VIC coils in real system.

I did not use any external signal sources during the testing.  Everything but power was generated on these three cards.  I did run into one problem I had to remove the 47uF capacitor on the A24 Gain Pot as it killed the signal.  Everything else worked as expected as this a fairly simple circuit and the Gain and OFF SET pots were used in the same configuration on the K8 card.  Part of the reason I removed it is this capacitor is label N/A on the K8 circuit.  With the capacitor removed the Pots do the functions described.  You can see this in screen shots in report. Sort of found this by accident as I mention in report as circuit was not working until a moved the test probe.  Then is started working until a notice a loose wire so I stopped and reset everything. Turned it back on it wasn't working again. Spent a couple of hours trouble shooting until a decide to pull the capacitor. Turns out one of things I knocked loose was the capacitor.

My guess this circuit was original setup to pass a higher frequency and block lower frequencies. Then K8 card was added. It appears to be setup on purpose to block higher frequencies as I could not get a 500Hz or higher signal through it. I believe this caused the capacitor on the gain side of that card  to be removed to allow lower frequencies through.  Now I am not sure what the correct frequency is but I did not change anything in K8 circuit.

This are more notes in my documents for these card about both these issues. Both issues caused many hours trying to figure out why the work the way they do. I expect people who understand amplifiers better than I do could give you the math why it works this way.

I think this finishes analog path with the exception of the Digital means piece and I pretty sure it just modifies pulse width of signal for accelerator operation.  As changing frequencies also does this I know pulse width changes moves through these cards with no problem.

I plan on working on cell driver circuit next as that should connect the carrier path and the gate path together on other side of primary from analog path. This is one those things I wanted to know where it was done for a long time. I thing I know how it is done now but I want to see it work.

Stanley A Meyer Output at 50Hz from fina

I have completed my initial testing of bread board version of the Cell Driver Circuit K4.  The Analysis and Testing Results are attached.

As drawn with the component values listed the circuit does not work.  I had to make 2 changes. I an fairly confident that after making these 2 changes the circuit is functioning the way it is suppose to.

1) Changed the supply voltage for Q6 first 3906 in circuit from +12VDC to +5VDC as the voltage on base has a 5-volt limit. Circuit started to work after making that change.  NOTE: The Analog Voltage Generator K8 uses almost the same configuration and it use VDD +5VDC

2) Changed the 22K resister on output of Q6 to 1K.  Things initially appeared to work until I got to input to Q8 where I found there was not enough signal strength to make it function.  After doing the replacement everything else worked.

The Report has screen shots of just before and after each component in the circuit which is how I was able to identify the problems.  It also helped that I had already built and tested K8 is it has almost the same circuit in part of it so I knew what to expect.

There have been several questions posted about why resistors where chosen and why the 3906 and 2n2222 are even there.  I think I found answers to most of questions and have included that information in the report.

While I did not use the normal input (G)for the tests which comes from Phase Lock Circuit K21 (have not built that one yet)  I did use the output from the Variable Frequency Generator K2 that I built.  This signal should be fairly close to the normal signal and I tested circuit across multiple frequencies. I have attached a screen shot of output for 1Khz using a 10 ohm resistor as load, which is close to 10.5 resistance of the primary coil listed in the estate information sheet.  Screen shots of other frequencies underload are included in the report.

Still have 3 more circuits to build, I have a lot of support items but still need to order a few more things. Finished building the board and checked final out put to see if I built it correctly. The finished board appears to have less noise on the output. That is with a 10 ohm resistor as the load.

Stanley A Meyer K4 1KHz Output 10 Ohm Lo
Stanley A Meyer Cell Driver K4  Test Set
Stanley A Meyer Cell Driver K4.JPG
Stanley A Meyer Cell Driver Bread Board
Stanley A Meyer Cell Driver Output of Fi

Finished testing the Resonant Scanning Circuit K22 today.

 

  I had it built a few days ago and put it aside as I had started working on testing the Phase Lock Circuit K21.  I ran into a couple issues with K21 in trying to get it to work. 

 

I thought I could at least test the voltage dividers circuit in K21 as it looked very similar in function to one in the Frequency Generator Circuit K2, but I could not get a signal out the CD4006B on pin 4. Turns out the Voltage Controlled Oscillator (VCO) that provides the signal to the voltage dividers requires Signal (F) to be present. 

 

Signal (F) is generated in this circuit so I decided to test it one before continuing with K21. This will give me a signal (F) I know and understand. 

 

I also may have burned out a couple of chips on K21 and needed to step away from it for a little while.  However, I did do enough testing and research to get a better understand of the VCO function and that signal (F) needs to provide voltage levels to the pin 9 of the CD4046B for it to generate the output frequency on pin 4.

I did find in analyzing and testing K22 is that it does not actually do the scanning that is done by K21.  What it does do is generate that the voltage control signal that the VCO needs to generate the scanning frequencies.

 

The CD4046B does all the tests to determine when systems is in resonant then sets the Lock signal (L) high to turn off the scanning control pulse being sent to output (F).  The Lock pulse when high also routes the resonant frequency on input (E) back out on signal (F) which stops the scanning process until system drops out lock, then cycle repeats.

I have written the analysis and test report but need to read and edit it a couple times, I have a lot of errors in first drafts.

 

Will post it here in a couple of days at most but wanted to a least get a screen shot of the normal scanning pulse on (F) posted here.  A31, 555 Timer, generates 12-volt clock pulses, with a wide pulse separation.

 

This means bias resistors and capacitor set the frequency of scans. This pulse train is past to A32 which turns the pulses into a 10-volt double ramp voltage pulse (ramps on both leading and training edges) with a sight pause in middle of pulse.

 

The slope of the ramps control how fast the operational frequency is scanned.  Slope is set by the feedback capacitor on A32.

 

  The result is the voltage control pulse that the VCO uses to generate the operational frequencies that are used to scan for resonance. It should be noted that the control pulses does determine the range of frequencies being scanned that is done in the CD4046B by the bias resistors and capacitors on its inputs. However, in the manual mode of operation output (F) can be used to help set those values.

Bottom line I believe K22 does what it is designed to do.  It provides one of the external functions mentioned in the data sheet for the CD4046B that supplement its ability to lock on a resonant frequency.  The VCO is just one part of that processes and K22 is a key part of configuring it to operate as desired.

I am getting closer to seeing the combined gated pulse and carrier frequency signals. Thought I found it in NOR on Input to K21.  Turned out to just be Inhibit level to CD4046B.  Looks like it is the (G) signal K21 outputs but I am not there yet though I have started testing that circuit.  Completing this circuit and testing it was another step in reaching that goal as I have another input identified and tested.

I also have the Pulser Indicator Circuit K14 built just need the 918m chip which I found on ebay and on the way (surface mount version) but I am not sure how I am going to test that one.

Report now added.

I have almost finished by testing of the Phase Lock Circuit K21. 

 

I had lots of problems with this circuit some due to lack of component values mainly on the capacitor which I have resolve.  Found posts with correct values in this forum I have a link to that in the report I am writing.  Thing I still having issues with is the (A) signal input. 

 

I can get it into the circuit but can not get the pulse past the first stage 4001.  At first I though it was because signal was not going completely low and that the Zener diode would fix this issue.  It did drop the signal offset to zero but did not solve the issue. 

 

I got side tracked working on other parts of circuit and testing other functions. I had check if signal input is high output of 4001 goes low and stops signal.  Normal state was High which is what you want for VCO to work so I went on to test and checking other things which took quite a while.  Never finished checking impact of the (A) gate. 

When I tried to do that I found I still could not get the (A) signal to switch the 4001 from high to low.  Turns out signal from K3 is not large enough to cause the 4001 to switch.  My testing shows it needs to be around 7 volts to get it to pass the gate pulse. 

 

But its only about 4.6 volts and only when I switch the 2.2K resister show on the diagram from ground to +12V.  I did get it to work with a 39 ohm resistor but that really got hot burned the marking on resistor.  Also did not like the fact that the Zener diode was letting higher voltage back to K3.

I tried dropping VDD in to 4001 to 10 volts to see what would happen - first it did not let the (A) pulse through and it also dropped output signal level (G) to 11 volts from 12 volts as the signal output level is determined by VCC.

Kind of odd that there is that much of a mismatch on signal levels.  May have the output on K3 wrong not sure but that is a 5 volt board. I know those chips do not like 12 volts it burns them out did that!  Need to solve this problem it is now last test in my testing but not sure what to do as I do not like using that small of resistor as a pull up as it pulls to much current and voltage levels are already a big issue with K21 circuit.

I do have most of the analysis and test report done just need to figure out how to test this problem before I publish it.

Stanley A Meyer K21 Lock signals with ph

I added the Analysis and Test Report document and picture of the lock frequencies with Math function showing phase relation to original post. 

 

I am doing it now as I am mostly done and happy with results I have seen so far.  I will do more testing when I have time. 

 

Biggest issue that I see is getting (A) signal interface working so I can see complete (G) signal.  I think I can fix this by using part of the circuit from K8 analog voltage generator is it turns signal into 12 volts I should not need final amplifier as dealing with CMOS levels.

As far as can tell all the rest of the interfaces worked though I do want to test (H) with the real signal not just my simulated one.

I do believe the decade counters have another purpose that the PLL function as I could not find a reason for them in this circuit.  My guess would during conditioning of cell.  They provide a means of outputting other frequencies without changing operation setup.  As Ronnie mentioned higher frequencies means higher voltages so they gives means of getting different voltages at flip of the switch.

Interesting I did not find a means of setting an upper limit on frequency unless to you set one using scanning range.  You might be able to this by settle the upper limit on scanning range near resonant frequency but normal you would put the resonance frequency in the center of your scanning range.

One big thing iI did get out this testing is your are not testing for frequency but for phase relationship of the resonance frequencies.  I remember reading several discussion but phase relationship in discussions on the VIC coils and chokes.
 coils.

It also appears the voltage level of feed back signal is not a big factor as long as there is enough of a signal for system to find edges to do phasing tests.  So again  I am not sure from what I have seen is trigger to keep system from running away.

 

Only way in this circuit would to find the frequencies that are just below resonance then set the front panel pot so voltage level to VCO is always below them then lock it.  Not sure this would even work it would also mean you resonant frequency would be the very end of you scan range rather in the middle where you would normally want it.  Its possible it is being done on the analog side by setting the gain upper limit.

I am almost done building and testing the basic circuits - I have to finish testing this one and then test the Pulser Indicator circuit K14. I have built that breadboard for it just not sure how I am going to test it.

I do hope people are finding these useful.  I built circuit just to see what they do and have learned a lot in doing that.  The reports were for me as they helped define what to test and how I was going to do test. 

 

What I have found is that the report also makes a great trouble shooting tool because my testing method of capturing the signal at each point in the circuit I can go back to report to see what signal should look like at those points.  I have had to do that a couple times when I damage things. I need to stop hooking up the wrong voltage or every worse hooking up  + voltage to ground. sadly I done that more than once.

I do have some family comments coming up that will keep me away for while.  So I am not likely to get to test K14 and finishing test this board until they are done.

 

On a bread board I built everything in circuit Analog Voltage Generator Circuit K8 from input through the first 2 amplifiers Q1 and Q2 including the 2 resistors on the output of Q2.  This the part of the circuit I built.  Looks like it going to exactly what I want.  Will need to hook everything back up to test it though as I put everything away. But at least this is an easy fix if it works.

Converts 3v signal into 12v signal using 6 resistors and 2 amps.

Yellow trace is the Signal (A) out of K3
Blue trace is the output of test circuit after 1K on output before 47K pull up.

Stanley A Meyer  Circuit to amplifly Sig
Stanley A Meyer Output of Circuit to amp

 track the Gate Pulse raised to 12V all the way through circuit from input until it reaches pin 5 on the CD4046B.  It now does what I expect as output of the first stage of 4001 now matches the input and output of second stages merges with (G) and there is a pulse sent to the inhibit input pin 5.  This pulse looks close to the (a) signal and that is what I would expect.  Before making this change it was always a flat line.

Went back to look at signal (G) which is not the combined Gate and Carrier signal. VCO generated output now has the gate pulse in it.
The good news is the signal has the Gate pulse in it the bad new system is now having a very difficult time locking. 
The bad new is that a pretty good lock is now very poor.  I expected this as Matt Watt had reporting in his testing of this circuit and new version, he is building that the gate interfered with the ability of the system to find and lock on resonance.

One thing I notice before fixing gate is that while the system is solid lock as you can see from this picture is the phasing spikes are on the leading and trailing edges and that they do not move around much but system still drops out of lock every 8 seconds.
What is interesting is that with gate in system the opposite happens.  The system only enters lock every 8 seconds then only briefly.
I did find a few articles that talked about an 8 sec problem with some PLL devices.  They were talking about using additional circuits to fix issue.  Seems to be a problem when you have a strong lock with sharp edges.  So, I am not sure this is caused by something the 4046 or by the control wave train created in K22.
 
With the gate pulse working I if a put the gate pulse on screen and trigger on it you can the gate in the (G) signal.  If you also turn on the Math function you can see the out of phase as well.  If I turned the scale on scope to show high frequencies and then adjust gate width on K3 you can see effect of gate on combined pulse train so that part of system is working the way in is described in Stan’s documentation.
Best way to see the pulse effect and is to stop the scanning control pulse is by putting K22 in manual mode and set the frequency using the Manual Freq Adjust Pot.   Now if you vary the pulse width using VIC Gating Adjust on K3 you can easily see the gate size changes.

I tried several things trying to get system to lock while gate pulse was present.  Setting the gate frequency to real low values seemed to the biggest help.  Every once in a while, you could see the frequency of the (G) signal flash on scope screen.  Most of the time frequency was below 1KHz.  I looked like it was scanning is too slow for it to get higher frequencies then a gate would appear, and it scan would continue.  Then 8 seconds would occur then a faster scan would happen, and you would see a brief lock then back to slow scan.
I tried to adjust frequency and the center point, and nothing seemed to make lock better when gate was present.  Only thing that seemed to always work is stopping the gate by either disconnection it, pulling Zener or putting on 2.2K pull down resister, basically killing inhibit functions.
I was being to believe that the scanning control wave train being created in K22 was running too slow or not formed correctly (see picture below) as there is a large gap in-between each pulse.  If you look at data sheet for 4046 it show scanning pulse to triangle wave train.  I think this is what I am see every 8 sec as this would be a fast scan.

I when to bed thinking this is a problem that needs to be fixed. I woke the next morning with a different view.  What if this is the way it is supposed to work and why.  My test of K22 shows that the scanning control pulse wave train never stops, and it is not reset.  What does happen in lock it is switched out for (E).  When lock it lost the control pulse is switched back at what every stage it is at.  So, what you have is a constantly varying signal at a fix rate, no signal for long period and then short scanning pulse and cycle repeats constantly.  If voltage increases with frequency increases and decrease when frequency decrease aren’t you in effect generate a wave that varies from 0 to max value then back to 0 on a set cycle like the AM wave in Puharick’s patent.

Assuming this is what the system is doing how would you use it?  How about using it in the condition phase and with the decade switches to step through the conditioning step up in voltage on the cell.  Keep in mind that resonant lock on the cell is not your goal at this point getting the cell to point conditioning cell is. Ronnie Walker and others say scope is jumping all over the place when then look at the signal coming out primary coil.  Maybe this is what they are seeing.

I did do a quick check of what could happen in you feed output signal (G) back into (H) to see what would happen and I got immediate lock which you expect as they are the same signal not sure what you would see with real feedback.  Will have to wait until I get more of system working with real feed to see what really happens.

In process of adding this and more screen shots of this testing to report will update the report above when I get done.

Stanley A Meyer K22 Scanning Control Pul

Today I decided to look at the data a different way.  I had been using a constant 5KHz signal as my (H) input which means system was trying to lock on this.  As I was thinking about this testing this is not the real case as input frequency should be close to the output frequency is fed back from signal being put into coils.

I did do a quick check of what could happen in you feed output signal (G) back into (H) to see what would happen and I got immediate lock which you expect as they are the same signal not sure what you would see with real feedback.  Will have to wait until I get more of system working with real feed to see what really happens.

Test configuration I had CH2 of scope on Pin 4 of 4046 and Pin 3 hooked to (H) input and CH1 of scope.  Note: This also gave me output of switch effect on (G) as it also feeds back into ping 3 (more on this later).

When I did this, I get solid lock with this pulse train (It stayed in solid lock for the all the rest of my testing). However, I am still seen scan cycle every 8 sec.  Found cause of this later in testing but will report where here. 

 

Check lock signal and had random spikes then decided to check (F) from K22 as I was in solid lock and should see a flat voltage except for every 8 sec. So thought must be something in K22 but then wonder why was it zero volts and (F) should be (E) when in lock.

 

  I then checked them both together and the both changed in step so K22 not source.  I also check the Lock signal and it is not changing state so something in 4046 is changing the state of (E) every 8 seconds and causing a scan.  Voltage on (E) was low as phase difference is low.

Both signals on the screen are at 10-volts then jump to 12-volt during scan.

At this point is very easy see the effect of changing the gate pulse width as signal stays in lock even during 8 second scan.  What is not easy to see is the actual frequency to the carries pulses in (s) as the frequency the gate pulses are what is picked up by scope un less you zoom so you are mostly seeing only one pulse then scope picks of the carrier frequency.

Things change when you start using the decade devices.  All the above was done at 4X which bypasses them.

Turns out this is easier to do if you use decade counters and switch.  I did this for all 3 counters and will post screen shots in report. 

This one is the 1x one discount frequency of blue trace which is (G) as it is not accurate. The Yellow trace is Pin 3.  In I zoom in even further so I am inside the decade output pulse the G is around 5KHz.

At this point I am a lot more comfortable with this circuit.  Trying to the lock test with a fixed input (H) allowed me to learn several things and was useful but it also caused some problems especially when trying to focus on lock

Using PIN 3 as source gave me solid lock and allowed to test and see other things.  In some ways closer to real system in at least frequencies where in same range but does show the phasing issues you would see in real system.

As much trouble I had seeing the carrier frequencies inside the gate signal as scope keeps trying to lock on the gate frequencies test the other side of coils is going to be interesting.

Stanley A Meyer K21 Decade counter 1X ou

I did post updated version of Report in first post in thread.  It has all the screen shots from decade testing and using (G) feedback into pin 3 as (H).

 

  System locked when I did this so you can see effect of gate on signal. Easy to see changes to gate POT on K3 when I did this.  Also you can see effect of the decade counters.

Just need to finish hard wired board and I have that half done and test already.  That with give me 7 of the 8 boards I planned on building. 

 

Just Pulse indicator left and I already have bread board version of that already done. But really need coils to test that properly. While likely do so simple functional test mainly to check that amplifier is working.

I has been interesting and fun and I learned a lot.  Still have things to learn.  I now know what most of the controls do but not what to set them at though some like the K3 are apparent - you turn knob to far and signal goes away and LED goes out.  I also saw this in testing this circuit as this was one of the main things I want to see in this circuit.

Hardest part was get the correct name to IC to do the search.  I did the bread boards as I did not want to deal with all the work of designing a real circuit board.  However, I did redraw all circuits by hand laid out close the way I was going to build them on the bread board. 

 

That was real helpful as I built from them and used them to check both breadboard circuit and hardwire version as it was the same layout. 

 

If someone wants copies of the layouts I could always scan them in to a PDF document. 

 

They are not pretty but they were helpful. I did copy real chip layout and used that in word document to print out the chips located near where they would be and then added connections and other parts in the locations I was going to put them.

================

Pictures of finished boards.

I finished moving components for the Phase Lock board to hardwired boards. 

 

Needed 2 cards as everything would not fit on one.  I also took a couple of pictures of all eight boards together. 

 

The top 2 on right are the Pulse Indicator which I have not tested yet but this should be its final form.  The breadboard behind it in back is the circuit I built to raise (A) to 12 volt levels.

 

I will put it on one of the other boards either the Cell Driver or the Pulse Indicator as there is extra room on both.

Everything has been tested except the Pulse indicator circuit and  they all work with the few minor changes I have made where things did not work at all.  These changes are all documented in Reports I have published in here.

 

I have been using temporary cables using power plugs you see on back of boards. 

 

They work well but it is sure a mess and too easy to hook them up wrong

- managed to do that a couple of times.

After I do that it will be time to start thing about coils and a better power supply.

Stanley A Meyer  Close Up of left 4.JPG
Stanley A Meyer  All Eight Circuits.JPG
Stanley A Meyer  Plase Lock  Front View.
Stanley A Meyer  Close up of Right 4.JPG
Stanley A Meyer Phase Lock  Top View.JPG

 scanned my working layouts and put them in the attached pdf. I had not indented to publish them in this form but they are what I used to built the bread board circuits as you need to know where the pins are located on the chips. I download pin out for each chip and then drew connections around them. 

 

After building board I double checked all connections again these drawings and also back against original circuit drawings. 

 

A lot of layout was driven by they way bread boards are made which both helped and hurt at times.  But it was an inexpensive way to get something built.

When I did testing I referenced items in report back to original circuit.

I do not have time right to do create better drawings and while I could do that it would be several days of work to do a good job.  I think I have posted pictures of all the finished boards along with report if I missed some I can go back and do that. 

 

Note:  Almost all the connections where done on the tops so I could see them and where they go though few are so close it is hard to tell. 

 

The attached drawings show chip pin connections which covers most of them.  In some cases where single point has multiple connection with either ground or power it was easier to just connect to them with multiple wires as you get the same affect.

Read the Doc Here 

Built holder for boards from 2 shelf boards as laying them out on table was taking to much room.  Wiring was mostly to route power to each board.

 

I left enough slack in wires so I could pull each board out to check it with a scope.  I was glad I did as I start to do system tests to see if everything was still working,

 

I found I had moved pot settings and needed to reset them to match setting from my initial testing. 

The scope shots in my test reports were very helpful in doing this.

Hopefully with this setup I can just connect the coils to connection strip on the end and continue testing.  One thing I do not like is the 2n3055 mounted on the leg make that whole leg to be at +12 DC.  I need to do something about that.

 

  I am still working though checking things, but I did find another issue I though I would report.  I started on the analog side and was working my way though resetting the pots and I am getting the results I expected after making the necessary adjustments until I got to the finally output to the primary coil.  Instead of the analog wave train I expect I kept getting a flatline voltage.

 

  This is from the 2N3005 (Q4 in K9 the Voltage Amplitude Control circuit).

I retraced the signal through the circuit, and everything matched until I got the final output instead of analog wave train, I got a flatline voltage. In my initial testing I did not have the output from the emitter of the 2n3005 connected to the switch and the last 1uF capacitor. 

 

The capacitor is the cause of the flatline.  Remove it and system works.  With it in you can still move the voltage level up and down but AM wave is gone. 

 

It does not make sense to have gone to all the work of creating the AM signal then remove it before sending it to primary coil.

It is possible this capacitor was intended to smooth out the noise on the AM wave as it has a lot of noise, however if this is the intended purpose 1uF is the wrong value.  However, if you want to smooth out noise on a 12-volt source then it would do that.

I am continuing to check the other boards that feed the 5KHZ side and have started to gather some of the material I need to make coils.  Looks like a should find the ferrite core first so I know what size and shape to make coils and bobbins. I know the dimensions for the areas for the wire but need to know size of hole inside bobbins.

Pictures below.  Front and back of finished boards mounted power comes in on left through a 12-volt connecter and there 2 LM317s one for 10v and on for 5v that feed bus bars on back.  Common ground through out system.  Boards powered from the bus bars.  Bus bar on the right will connect to primary and feedback coils.

The scope shots show the output of the 2n3005 with the one with capacitor in circuit and one with it removed.   This is the signal going to one side of primary coil.  The yellow trace is the 50Hz signal input used to create AM wave.  I have it on screen to provide a good sync for the scope.

Stan;ey A Meyer System  setup.JPG
Stanley A Meyer K9 AM wave output.JPG
Stanley A Meyer K9 Output with cap on ou
Stanley A Meyer K9.JPG

Main reason I built Stan's circuits is to try to find out what that signal shape should look like.  Also I had several questions about how he did things. 

 

Where was gate generated?. How did he create the AM wave and what did it look like?  Where did he created the  high frequency pulse train? How did he merger them all together. 

 

Building his circuits and testing them has answered most these questions though with all the adjustments in the system I am still not sure what the exact signal should look like.  Still plan to do more testing to learn more.

I sure Stan did not start with these circuits but built them base on other experiments and knew what wave shape he wanted them to output. He used parts that were available at the time.

I plan to take a good look at work Nav did on AM signals and chokes to understand that part of system much better.  See his recent post on AM wave testing.

Stanley A Meyer Cell off with Sw on AM b
Stanley Test setup accross input to Pri
Stanley A Meyer Small gate.JPG
Stanley A Meyer Large gate.JPG
Stan;ey A Meyer 50 Per cent gate.JPG

After writing this and looking at screen shots the 2 signals look the same just at different levels.  I begin to wonder if something had happened to analog signal.

 

So, I disconnected it and went back and rechecked output of board using setup I had used to check analog path.  I set scope for CH1 yellow to be 50Hz reference from K2 CH2 blue to be analog signal which was the triangle wave train, so it was working. 

 

I then hooked it back to output strip but left CH1 hooked to 50Hz reference and got the following signals.  I again varied gate size on K3.  Switching off analog gave flat line.  This was the analog signal I expected to see. 

 

Did not expect pulses on top but was glad to see them.   But they are there as all inputs to primary coil are hooked up including diodes. I am beginning to see why people say scope shots do not make a lot of sense. 

 

Would not have seen the analog wave in this form if I had not changed scope sync reference.   Note:  I used same ground reference for all of these screen shots.

Stanely A Meyer Analog signal large gate
Stanely A Meyer Analog signal 50 per cen
Stanely A Meyer Analog signal with small

As using a separate sync source gave me such a good view of the analog signal, I decided to look at the pulse stream the same way. 

 

I went back to K2 and tried all four switch settings on one of the other switches, the 500Hz output gave me the best view of the shape of the pulses. 

 

Picture was taken at about 50% gate setting.  You can also see effect of gate changes in this view.  This was taken just before diode going into Primary coil like the other pictures above.

At this point I am not sure what the output modulation frequency is as the gate messes up that reading on my scope.  I will need to go through K21 again and check center frequency I am sure it was changed when I mounted board and I have not yet tried to reset it. 

 

In this testing I was check that all the boards worked together, and primary goal was to see what signals looked like at input to primary transformer. I think I did that.

Stanley A Meyer Close up view of pulses

I tried to set the center of the CD4046B to 5khz.  This is kind of a pain to do with the gate active as scope syncs on the signal with gate so you cannot see the true frequency. 

 

To do this I bypassed the circuit that raises the gate level to 12-volt levels.  This leaves the gate signal present, but it never goes high so gate in not present in signal. 

(See report on K21 for more detail on this). 

 

I may put a switch on the board that has the circuit to raise it gate level so I can select the bypass mode so I can set center level.

Once I set the gate level low, I used the Manual Freq. Adjust Pot on K22 (Resonant Scanning Circuit) and the Freq.

 

Adjust Pot on K21 (Phase Lock Circuit) to set center frequency on CD4046B to 5khz.  You must set the pot on K22 to a high enough level to make adjustment to pot on K21, so you set center level this high.  I checked output of pin 4 of the CD4046B to do this. 

 

 While I was at it, I also verified that the levels out into switch from the divide by 10 chips where correct and they were.  So, I have 5khz, 500hz, 50hz and 5hz out of the switch.

My goal was to capture the input to primary coils as a known 5khz center.  I have not yet built primary and secondary coils, but I do have a 1 to 1 60hz isolation transformer so I hooked that up across the 10-ohm resistor and diode so I could see signal out of primary and secondary coils.

The screen pictures below show signal with pot setting above and gate active at 50% duty cycle.
Signal across 10-ohm resistor alone
Signal across 10-ohm resistor with transformer connected
Signal output from transformer
Signal output form transformer showing frequency sweep every 8 seconds.  As I mentioned in K21 report this sweep is present not sure why.


Have been thinking about this for a while and wonder if it is from way the sweep signal in K21 is setup (see K21 report for details).  The K21 signal looks like a piece of a triangle wave just one period with a flat line in between each period.

 

Yet the data sheet for CD4046B shows this input to be a triangle wave.  It is possible that the valves for components controlling the 555 timer on K21 are incorrect as this sets the timing of the pulse that creates the sweep wave.
Most likely will look at this some more as I had not looked at K21 input requirements when I did original K22 to testing.

Next step is to build and test some coils.  Have already started collecting parts but do not have much experience with this.

I built Stan's control circuits to see what they did. I have finished those and plan on starting to work on coils and cells.  I would like to avoid building cells at first if I could hence the questions about using capacitors.

As far as I can tell without having the VIC and cells, Stan's control circuits generate an AM  type wave in 50Hz range also a 5KHz carrier also is in range.  So the output his control circuits is very consistent with what you are reporting here.  I had started building those circuit as I was not sure how to test and tune the coils. Your explanation in here is a great help as it provides a why to do that.

I have been following your other posts and was glad to see you still working on this. I also believe using your method makes testing and understanding the coils easier to do.  The controls in Stan's circuits are extremely touchy and a change in one area requires you to make a change in another area and without knowing what you are trying to accomplish makes setting it up correctly very difficult.

On other thing I noted was I could not see anywhere in his control circuits a method to change the voltage across the coils except a switch to connect directly to a 12 volt source. When this is used much of his control circuit is by passed.  Ronnie mentioned in one his post voltage was stepped up using by raising frequency.  My guess is systems limits may be determined by using method similar to what you are doing. Then this information is used to setup the control system to stay within those limits.

Ronnie also stated that changing gap in core was to do a ruff phasing adjustment which agrees with you statement above.

from testing I have done so far that is correct.  The AM carrier frequency does not change it goes into one side of the primary transformer.  The modulation frequency does change and it go into the other side of the transformer.  The other thing that does change is the gate size which controls the number of modulation pluses on each AM pulse.
 

Stanley A Meyer 2 frequencies.png

So it looks like the Frequency carrier goes by one path to one side of the primary coil and the analog frequency goes to the other side of the coil the analog voltage generator and control path. 

 

NOTE: Using the 4 selector switches on the front panel the two frequencies do not have to be the same and most likely are not.

The Total VIC Assembly

This is only 1 of the 14 working version. many people get lost on this version be sure to look at the assembly version map here first as there are very easy ways to use stans tech now

 

IN this version 

Here a lot of people have not understood really what Stan was doing. So it's a method for
obtaining the release of a fuel gas including hydrogen and oxygen from water, during
which the water is processed as a dielectric media in an electrical resonant circuit
 

Then he shows the cell, here, which basically consist of concentric cylinders and this
... ; but here is the circuit, and basically there is not much to at what he is saying he is
putting 50% duty cycles pulses into this transformer and creating pulses that are going
to the fuel cell winch is designed to be a capacitor.

Now, the obvious problem with this situation is this, he is using the word resonant
here, like salt and pepper all the way through.

This is not a resonant circuit, this was part of the diversion about how to keep
people, how he protected the idea without actually leading people to understand what was going on, and the proof that this is not a resonant circuit lyes in the blocking diode ! huuuuuuu gushh

so what you can see here is what he is really doing is this, this system works without electrolyte (MDG: Air being the dielectric layer to breakdown) ; so the purpose of it is, he wants his water to have a fairly high resistance in it, and so, here is what he is gona do, he got this chokes, this chokes are very important because when he puts this inductive spikes on, here, ... with the diode, what he is doing is, he is charging this capacitor, and the resonant chokes are specifically to damp the voltage spikes that could prematurely set this thing off.

So what he is doing, he is making sure that he can charge this capacitor with kind
of soft pulses and pulse the thing up, so he can get this capacitor to charge to the
maximum degree before the dielectric material, in this case water, creates a
catastrophic dielectric failure in the capacitor
At which point, all the charge in the capacitor, all the voltage in the capacitor is
converted to amps as a shorts out internally, and orderly destroys the water it
moves through and creates massive quantities of hydrogen and oxygen.
(minute 3.00 of this video)
and as soon as it's out of the way, water rushes its back in, the dielectric constant is
again re-established, and this is what's happening, while this is happening, he waits,
and starts charging again.
(showing of patent page drawing progressive water molecule stretching under pulses
train)
again this types of drawing were made to confuse people, you know the idea of
drawing this things are that these were increasingly large resonant pulses and
everything, this is all a bunch of ... , all he is doing is just like any other voltage
multiplier that's used in pulsing, all you are looking up is a step ramp charger on a
capacitor until it reaches it's catastrophic failure, that is the method of the Stan
Meyer's system, and it does produce massive amounts of gas for a very small amount
of electricity.

The Picture Below is the general Assembly  it is not 100% correct missing diode and some parts  mis placed, it is posted here because is show the general assembly  When I get time I will perfect this pic 

all the correct data is on this website.  Questions are welcomed we have these  fully replicated and working

Stanley A Meyer VIC Assembly Ttansformer
Stan has 10 of these Paralleled making
between 20 kv and 90 kv DC  , they can also be sequentially fired or all on same time pinned to tps

Backup and yes we have 4 to 5 backups you should immediately do same download it now be warned 

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Stanley A Meyer Scope Shots VIC.png
Note th Picture Above these note about winds may be wrong better to use the other wind numbers this picture is just for the scope shots 

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A closer explanation of the first order of function (IMO) required to hit resonance.

Reference Papers:

 

1. Electrical Efficiency of Electrolytic Hydrogen Production

2. An Investigation into the Electrical Impedance of Water Electrolysis Cells-With a View to Saving Energy

3. Hydrogen Production by Alkaline Water Electrolysis All these papers explain that Hydrogen and Oxygen gas bubbles on the surfaces of electrodes, and in the solution reduce the conductivity (increase the resistance) of the cell.

 

This is one of many methods Stan may have utilized to restrict current in the system. More methods will be discussed in future videos.

Stanley A Meyer Switches.JPG

These potentiometers are pre-fixed settings.

 

"Off-Set" = initial value.

"Gain" = amount of amplification input / output

so:when you turn the ''gain '' you adjust the voltage amplitude going to the cell,

and when you turn the offset''you reset it?

"Off Set": is set to determine the beginning of the process of "gain".
'' ANL / FREQ'': only for testing purpose during the setup.
  Digital: processed in "DIGITAL CONTROL MEANS" (fig. 2).
Analog: processed in the "ANALOG VOLTAGE GENERATOR" (Fig. 3).
As the pin 3 ... 4046 this link has been modified to Minimize propagation delays.

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Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit Card

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WHAT IS THE VIC CIRCUIT ?

 

It produces  the modulated voltage & frequency and is the driver for the vic coils

with a scanning circuit and locking circuit. it is what makes the vic system

work and keep working to generae the Gas from wet cell electrolyzer with higher yeild than normal electrolysis and runs in resonance at a certain frequency.

 

The VIC transformer performs multiple functions. 

1. voltage stepup by transformer action 
2. impedance matching 
3. amp inhibition 

Effectively, it aids transfer energy to the water capacitor and keeping the voltage up (escaping into the return circuit) until the dissociation action kicks in by charge separation. Its very difficult to articulate this without pictures. 

 

The vic driver circuit produces  precision square wave with a 50%duty cycle as the main frequency, and it has a precision adjustable gate which adjusts the unipolar pulse train on time and the gate off time, also there is a variable voltage.  

 

Included in this Circuit is a transformer arrangement SEE VIC BOBBINS with chokes on a common ferrite core.

 

The Vic Coils are tune to match the Cell style and resistance and capacitance in each case. 

NOte If you want to use the meyer circuits, then the circuit has to match the tube set of that circuit. You can not just take a circuit from the patent and just use any tube set you want on it. it does not work that way. 

Most likely if you add tube sets, the voltage is devided by each set. however, that may change once the process takes over. 

the only way to experiment with meyers stuff is to build the entire system.

Say the 8xa......circuit, inductor, full tube set and adjustable plate set........you will not get the right reaction with 2 small plates. say the 9 tube set was 5uf, the big plate set was 9uf....your little plates are 2pf........ you will not get the correct reaction with 2pf. 
There is a Method to each Patent they are not interchangable. 

now take the resonate cavity..............that vic resonates with that tube set............10 tube sets.........it will not resonate with the big tube set or 1 single cell . it has to be tube pairs, 2 tubes inner outer 1 wired +/- inner outter and one wired -+ inner outter to balance reistant load to match coils on core. 

 

Typically a gapped core serves the purpose of increasing reluctance.  In the VIC design having multiple windings dedicated to specific sides of the core, I imagine there is a need for flux separation between these two halves.  However, any gap in the core increases the reluctance of each halve as well as the complete core.  The windings that are together on each halve should have stronger coupling, but without being able to see where these are and their polarity, it is a little difficult to describe the mode of operation.

 

Seems to me that the gap could at least in part be used for balancing the resonance between the 2 chokes and the water cell.

 

​GMS UNIT EMS ECU STANLEY MEYER

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Hydrogen Hotrod Willies

This resulting energization is applied to the VIC to create the physical gas production effects in the resonant cavity enclosure.

Modern PPL Digital radio use auto  phase lock loop to find channels or resonance. not that as the pick up coil be doin that.on one gap on one side of core only.

take the big bobbin, it is made to resonate with the injector chamber.......

it will not work with the other tube sets 

This is important to understand from the start.You have to do exactly what meyer did, and 1 tube set will not work. the only place meyer used one tube set is in the injector. 

 

  1. You will need a frequency generator that is capable of doing gating. If it does not do gating your wasting your time.

  2. Next you will need a fast switching Transistor capable of switching in the Khz range and handle several amps to turn the primary of the transformer on and off just like a switch and a few other parts on the primary side. When your switching the power from your source to the primary, it takes a certain amount of time (T1) to fill the primary inductor to the level of the source voltage.

  3. You need to be able to measure this time it takes to reach the voltage of your source. If not, your wasting your time again. You do not want anymore time other than what it takes for the primary inductor to reach your source voltage which makes the magnetic field. Any more time than that is wasted in heat and or loss and core saturation. If you ever wondered what those pulse wave forms were in his drawings on the primary side, he is showing you that it takes an amount of time and pulses to reach the source voltage in the primary and then turn it off. This is called a time constants, and they are divided into frequency pulses. He shows 5 pulses most of the time on his drawing. 

  4. You will have to do the math to get yours on your primary.

  5. Now once you have did that you will have a collapsing magnetic field which induces into the secondary inductor and through the diode because it acts as a switch and is closed due to voltage from the primary collapsing and inducing a voltage into the secondary since the diode is close the chokes are part of the secondary ratio which is also an inductor and the voltage dumped into the cell.

  6. There is a time that this takes place this is called(T2) the other pulses after the choke in his drawings))

  7. You also will have a time constant for this as well. When the cell is charged to the voltage of the secondary and the inductor chokes, due to the turn ratio of the primary and secondary and chokes.

  8. This is your gating. Gating is just the time it takes for the secondary and the chokes to charge and place a charge on the capacitor.

  9. Now when the gating is turned off and when you start the pulse to the primary again another thing happens,

  10. The diode opens and the choke inductor collapses and creates another even higher voltage into the cell.

  11. This is how you get your step charging and frequency doubling. It all has to do with T1 and T2 they have to be right on the money or you want get step charging.

  12. Of course matching the inductor and capacitor, frequency and tuning the circuit (not included) LOL All this happens in an instant of time. 

This also has a Magnetic feed back oil to the cicuit to tune resonant to allow voltage to raise rapidly.  The Switch component can be controlled by Acellerator pedal and the pickup from Pedal sensor can adjust the duty cycle and voltage to cell. 

 

The Vic voltage Intensifier Circuit was used by Stanley Meyer , in between the PWM and the Electrolyzer Cell Wet Cell. (water Capacitor)

It operated from a Switch circuit and raise the Voltage from PWM to the Electolyzer into the KV range.

 

 It has 2 Chokes which are Tuned 

to the Match plates, so matching chokes (each choke same size as each other if the plats in the electrolyzer are the same size..

 

If it is Tube Cell Electrolyzer then the choke sizes are different this inner is smaller surface are so that choke will be small to tun so both

in resonance. 

 

Meyer had 10 VIC 1 for each Cell.  This may have had 1 common PWM disving the switch for each as Cells in electrolyzers  were in series.. 

Individually power but balanced on electolyzer. 

 

The Core was 2000 Perm Ferrite core, It is a sensitive Design and work is in progress on firming the reliability of it. 

 

 

Hydrogen Hot Rod

All the VIC s are based on the similar concept.

transformer, to inductors, to cell low amps higher voltage

 

Wire Size 

Stan's VIC primary is either 29 or 30 awg wire. Some people say 29 some say 30, My question is has anyone looked at the ampacity of these two wire sizes?

Ronie,as i understant stan used the same wire size for all coils.Ampacity?max curent flow?(sory my bad english).The 29awg would pulse with more curent than the 30awg.wire diameter, determines the amp flow. to many amps melts the wire

 

1. I think there are more parts that are not shown in Stan's drawings. (maybe that is why it does not work)

2. Someone told me about the missing parts in Stan's drawings.

 

3. Produce a higher voltage on the primary than 12volts using 12volts. 24 volts

( look into the design of a fly-back transformer)

 

 

4. The chokes are part of the turn ratio of the secondary.

 

5. You can not just use a frequency generator and a transistor to pulse the transformer.

 

6. Phasing the transformer is critical to getting it to work."

 

7.The VIC board only has one signal generator. It gets joined with the gate driver circuit.

 

 

The pickup coil

is used for resonate feedback to the scanning and PLL circuit that senses resonance. More or less senses the highest peek voltages and locks onto that frequency. More Below on the Phase Lock Loop Design from stanley Meyer below.

 

A phase-locked loop or phase lock loop (PLL) is a control system that generates an output signal whose phase is related to the phase of an input signal. While there are several differing types, it is easy to initially visualize as an electronic circuit consisting of a variable frequency oscillator and a phase detector. The oscillator generates a periodic signal. The phase detector compares the phase of that signal with the phase of the input periodic signal and adjusts the oscillator to keep the phases matched. Bringing the output signal back toward the input signal for comparison is called a feedback loop since the output is "fed back" toward the input forming a loop.

Keeping the input and output phase in lock step also implies keeping the input and output frequencies the same. Consequently, in addition to synchronizing signals, a phase-locked loop can track an input frequency, or it can generate a frequency that is a multiple of the input frequency. These properties are used for computer clock synchronization, demodulation, and frequency synthesis.

Phase-locked loops are widely employed in radio, telecommunications, computers and other electronic applications. They can be used to demodulate a signal, recover a signal from a noisy communication channel, generate a stable frequency at multiples of an input frequency (frequency synthesis), or distribute precisely timed clock pulses in digital logic circuits such as microprocessors. Since a single integrated circuit can provide a complete phase-locked-loop building block, the technique is widely used in modern electronic devices, with output frequencies from a fraction of a hertz up to many gigahertz.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phase-locked_loop

 

http://www.sentex.ca/~mec1995/gadgets/pll/pll.html

 

What is Resonance

At resonance. 

They will be no amp draw from your power source at resonance the transistor will run cold not even warm. This plainly states no amp flow in the cell. Nothing but voltage.

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This shows the amp draw from your battery or power supply at resonance. He states at startup the amp draw will be 25 m/amp and at resonance it will be 1-2 m/amp.

Also, if it entered the airspace of another country without transponder data or communication, is it possible it was shot down?

The chokes are part of the turn ratio of the secondary. Which means that the secondary turn and the choke turn are all added together for the ratio on the secondary side of the transformer. What he left out was the word (and) in between secondary charging chokes.

http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Honeywell/392JA50K/?qs=%2fha2pyFaduhDOCKt20U9cFcOvaq0S9kP20pqEwlrYeHG1yY04GUTjA%3d%3d 

 

Those pots are nice because you can lock them down so they won't move. They use a locking collar, and they are less than a 1 turn pot.

Stans voltage intensifier card

 

There are 4 chips in the bottom left quarter of the card. The bottom 2 of the 4 are CMOS chips but does anyone on the forum know the ID of the top 2?


It's part of the PLL and i'm wondering if there is a PLL chip in there or all 4 chips are part of an early flip flop style PLL?
An interesting observation is the resistor between the yellow primary and the red inductor.

 

If this is in series with the inductors and the cell then during mode 1 @ 5Khz is it acting like a shunt to get current circulating through the water and load the inductors?

 

The diode at the top is interesting, definately not a 1198 and his switching transistor is an RCA3055, going to download the PDF for that and study its harmonic distortion.

 

Really need those 2 chip codes if anyone has any ideas?

Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit
Stanley A Meyer Vic Circuit
Stanley A Meyer Vic Circuit

the upper one is a cd4046B pll vco,

 the next beyond is a cd4001.

 

pic added will show that in detail.
hope that helps.

 

gpssonar should have actual circuit diagram he´s working on his replication.

 

I also have a circuit diagram from 2010 because at that time I rebuilt that circuitry.

Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit
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Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit
Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit
Stanley A Meyer VIC Cicuit voltrolysis
Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit
Stanly A Meyer VIC Circuit Boards
Stanly A Meyer VIC Circuit Boards
Stanly A Meyer VIC Circuit Boards

the purpose of chokes

are to limit amps. however, clearly stan called them charging chokes and speaks of a charge pump. a cell is not a charge pump. the inductors are the charge pump.....resonant charge pump...... the cell then receives that charge the only way to do that is to charge the transformer, which is how i get the step charge on the scope. the chokes are on the same core as the transformer, so they are charged when the transformer is charged the only way to see it, is to do it.......you need the setup of meyer, or simular i have giving everyone the circuit designs, that i use and don gave everyone the transformer details, and cell details 

 

The chokes are wound all in the same direction that is right and agreed to by me. But when this is said that way it really would lead people down the wrong road when they hook them to their cells. Lets look at the coils of wire in the chokes as being a spring all ready wound tight due to the primary inducing a magnetic field into them.

 

This is the example I'm going to use to show how the magnetic field inducing and collapsing. Now when they are induced they are wound tight and that is the direction of voltage (CW), on the positive choke when the field collapses and the spring unwinds and the induced voltage goes toward the cell (CCW), the way we want it to. Now on the neg. choke when it is wound tight (CW) and the field collapses (all coils wound in the same direction) will induce the voltage back into the secondary (CCW). This is something we don't want. We loose our neg. potential.

 

Now for some people, they would not know how to correct this problem. We want the induced voltage to be (CCW) and the collapsing field to go into the cell also on the neg. side(CW). So the solution is to switch the wires of the choke so the collapsing field will go into the cell (CW) so we have the same potential voltage as the positive potential going into the cell. Now we have the same voltage potential on both sides and not reflecting our neg. potential back into the secondary. I hope I got my CW AND CCW RIGHT....lol

 

Now the primary has to be phased right also or everything will go the wrong way on the secondary side. For those that knows how phasing works, the primary has to be out of phase to the secondary, the secondary is in phase with the positive choke and out of phase with the neg. choke to make a long story short in order to get the collapsing voltages to go where they need to be which is in the direction of the cell.

 

Size and tuning chokes 

 

The capacitance is determined on each inner area and outter area seperatly. The reason for this is the way the cell is charged, and the inner and outer has different surface areas and each choke has to resonated at the same frequency with each surface area. In order for it to resonate at the same frequency the cokes has to match each surface area. If you all remember the formula Stan has in his Tech Brief. It is for one surface area only. Ever wonder why the neg. choke is smaller? It's because the positive side of the cell has a larger surface area. Stan siad the the chokes had to be the same length in most of his patents, but that was for a plate cell wher both plate areas were the same and not for a cylinderical cell. His formula always threw me for a loop that he had in the Tech brief. Now after a year later, now everyone has the answer.

 

Give it a shot and you will see it works, You will have the same charge potential on both plates and also the same resonance action taking place on both surface areas. Took me a fricking year to figure this one out.

 

So if i have both chokes the same lenght the cell wil never resonate because the plate area diference?

 

Only on a plate cell with the same area on each plate. If you try to use the same inductors on a cylinder cell you will have a differece of potential voltage. I always thought they had to be the same length and same inductance also until I can across this problem and thats how I found it. Here is some numbers that you can compair it to, this is the resistance of the secondary pos choke and neg choke from don' s readings of Stan's vic!!!! Secondary=72.4 ohms, pos choke=76.7 ohms neg choke=70.1 with these numbers you can add the chokes resistance together and divide that by 2 and you will get 73.4 which is real close to the secondary resistance.

 

Even though the neg choke is smaller and the pos is larger than the secondary they still add up to the same turn ratio while balancing the potential. As you can see with these numbers all he did was took from the neg choke and added back to the positive choke while balancing the potential voltage and keeping the turn ratio the same also matching the inductance at the same time. Stan was a clever man I must admit.

 

This is very interesting. I am reviewing the tech brief. Is this what Stan was reffering to on page 1-4? It seems he knew about this interaction and used a variable choke to determine some of his operating/design characteristics. Thank you for your information. RAV EMU 

 

I think this is what he is trying to explain when he states "Dual-inline RLC Network"

Gating 

Stan states that the gate was used to tune into a resonant condition of the water's movement between the tubes.

Only one gate generator was used for all eleven tube sets.

In Don's schethes he shows pin22 on the vic card outputing to the gate circuit,every card had this output to the gate circuit?

If only one gate with one vic card was used why did he build 9?  

 

The gating circuit was used to drive all the boards at the same time. It is a manual adjusted frequency. Stan says it is used to dial into resonant action of the water between the tubes. You have LC resonance in the coils and a resonance action of the water molecule stretching and relaxing till it pulls apart.

 

the plls vco is being adjusted by the resonant feedback 
Plus, scanning circuit, (opamp integrator) 
The bilateral switch can be a simple mux (multiplexer like the 4052/3) 


If you are going off of the components and values given  PAy Attenion to detail the capacitor between pin 2 and 6 of the 741 op amp ( on the analog frequency generator) The second one away from the darlington pair driving transistor. Its value is not 47uF, but rather .47uf.Sometimes a detail here and a detail there can make quite a difference

 

The Circuit is very important to get right but the key is not the circuit, the key is a working vic coil you have to get the coil working correctly before you can use that scan, lock circuit 
nce we have matched the coils correctly with the perm of the core giving us the correct frequency of around 5khz with a applied voltage of around 14.4v & 0.03mA we should be good to go with this board? 
What about the gate card? I am thinking the VIC board will be no good with out it?!? 
What do you suggest we do?  Build our own gate card? 

stans first circuits had no pll or scanning 
mechanism, (those were probably used just to increase effeciency) 
The circuit on his rotary generator was rather primitive. Just a 555 
a few dividers and an inverter and 3 opto couplers. But a plls vco gives 
a much better quality oscillation, and it changes value over time trying to 
shift the phase of the incoming signal and comparing that to a reference 

i have the gate board, it just needs some cuts and jumpers 
but really a hand frequency gen will work just fine 
your hand is the tuner and lock 
as long as it is a fine tune adjustment.  the 9xa  was stans experimental board, you can use it for the main frequency, however, since experimenting with that circuit and the car vic circuit, i discovered that the gate needs to be more adjustable, which calls for a gate like meyer made on the car vic board. then use a transistor driver like on that epg board 

 

Notes 

In Stan's 11 cell system, the positive and negative wire of the VIC Primary Coil are both controlled by transistors.  One transistor is responsible for the pulse train, while the other transistor is responsible for the voltage amplitude.   The pulse train amplitude stays the same through out the process.  The design intent was to limit the amount of gas produced.  There was also a toggle switch to bypass the voltage amplitude transistor, and supply direct 12 Volts to always produce maximum gas output.

 

You want a high voltage in order to make the process efficient.  Example: Power Lines operate with a very high voltage.  They do so in order to minimize the losses associated with current.

So, yeah, I'd say that you can pick any voltage you want.  You just have to design your components off of that value.  Generally speaking, the higher the better.  But be careful with high voltage!!!:exclamation:

Example: take an Electrolytic capacitor.
(forget "water fuel capacitors"!!! for the time being.)
If you go over it's rated Voltage... it blows up.  Why?  It was designed to take a certain voltage.  Once you go over it.... well, anything can happen. :D

Could you explain your setup in more detail please? and what you mean by each plate has 1.8 volts? Thanks.
Kind of a quick walk through for the steps in the excel spreadsheet are as follows:
1) determine capacitance (based on your construction)
2) determine what frequency to use (just pick a number)
3) determine your inductor size. (Based on steps 1 & 2)

Now, "3)" is a little tricky.  This is a Series RLC circuit.  So, by that logic.  "3)" is equal to the sum of all of your "L" values in series.  Now, since "3)" has given us our needed TOTAL "L" value we must figure out how much goes on the "Positive side" and "Negative side."

The way gps and I were looking at it.  if you've got square plates then the inductors you need will be equal on both sides of the plates.  BECAUSE YOUR SURFACE AREA DOESN'T CHANGE. 

Furthermore, if you use two concentric cylinders your surface area on both "plates" are different. I.E. your Inductors are directly related to the amount of surface area of one of your "plates".

 

Q&A Max Miller

 

Alright, look at stans international patent and 
Look at the analog circuit. Look at the transistor, 
(the npn darlington pair) does an npn belong there? 
Is this a mistake?

the npn is fine  the circuit is fine 

I am talking about the amplifying transistors, Q5 and Q4, 
Analog circuit of the international patent.Try to draw current through an npn transistor, connecting the collector to vcc

 

i use an optocoupler to a 2n3055 
more or less a darlington pair 
the 2n3055 will handle 15 amps, the optocouple oonly passes the amps needed for the base turn on of the 2n3055 

same thing with the meyer schematic. 
the tip120 is a darlington transistor , the rest of the driver just needs to turn on the base of the tip120 
all current then passes through the tip 120, not the rest of the circuit. they are just simple transistors. with pull down resistors and bias resistors. 

 

You are just using 1 driving transistor between ground and your coil right? 
An npn works there.. Im not questioning that

 

But i find it strange that the 2n3055 (which is more of An audio transistor is used to switch, and a tip 120 
Is used for an analog function... Seems reversed

 

that 2n3055 on the heat sink of the vic is used as a voltage regulator. to manually turn the voltage up and down. the voltage control circuit is on the vic board.  so he can change the voltage into the primary up and down

 

yes the 2n3055 is used in radio amplifiers, but its just a transistor and is what it does here is simular to an amplifier. biased voltage on the base ,the tip120 is a darlington transistor which is faster then a single transistor. so the on and off pulse for the coil is fast the voltage change can be slower

Stanley A Meyer Vic Circuit
Stanley A Meyer Vic Circuit
Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit

The tip is actually switching 
The coil. That makes sense. 

Another thing I want to ask is this: i assumed the gate pulse 
Was in a low state, but when the inhibit (pin 5 of the pll)is triggered 
It drives Point G to a low state, turning on the pnp (first transistor in the amplifier circuit driving 
The tip) which means the gates pulse is High.??? 
The coil becomes saturated and it only slightly collapses during the period of repetitive pulsing. 
The coil at this points stores potential energy...released during the pulsing?

 

"if I have an electro-magnet, and I draw a piece of metal up to it that 
Weighed 1 ton, if I kept pulling on it, I would never break the field, but how 
Much energy does it take to go over there and simply turn off the switch? 
Wouldnt that metal simply fall apart?....so under covalent switch off..." 

 

Now, was his vic primary coil observed as a single winding, unidirectional; 
Or was it a dual primary, bidirectionally wrapped, and longitudinally spiralled 
According to the tech briefing? Or Was the steam resonator coil the vic matrix coil?

 

the vic board is fires the tip120 with a 50% duty cycle, it is the same wether inverted or not. the gate at the tip120 will be on for the pulse train then off when there is no pulse train............. at the coil 
i believe they call that being low 
the coil does charge up, but not saturated. a saturated coil would just me a magnet, with no reversing

energy must be used in the magnet.....not exactly what meyer did though

 

Re This 

Now, was his vic primary coil observed as a single winding, unidirectional; 
Or was it a dual primary, bidirectionally wrapped, and longitudinally spiralled 
According to the tech briefing? Or Was the steam resonator coil the vic matrix coil?[/QUOTE 

the primary is a single coil 
500 or 600 turns of 30ga 
secondary is around 3000 turns 30 ga 
c1 is around 3000 turns of 30 ga 
c2 is around 2800 turns of 30ga 
all in the same direction in relation to the core shape 
the feedback was center tapped......looks to be 
looks like the steam resonator was maybe missing from the pics.

 

500 or 600 turns on the primary!!!? 30 guage? 
Are you serious? That is wild! Of course he would be 
Using micro amps, thats an insane resistance. Lol 

Thank you kindly, ive built a lot of hho cells, but never one with such a complicated 

Driver circuit. This is not just a 555 driving a mosfet...

 

yeah, amp restriction voltage amplification, precising adjustment of the pulse, (pulse width, pulse dwell, pulse frequency), perfect coil construction allowing for the resonant effect to take place....

 

 

A lot of people do not know this, but 
When you put a voltmeter, between a resistance (in our case, water between two plates) 
In a secondary circuit, (using an electromagnetic field instead of a 
battery) the voltmeter will read 2 different values(at the same point, in the same time frame..depending on the orientation of the meter), kirchhoffs rules do not 
Apply, (faradays law holds true, kirchhoff is a special case of faraday, where d(phi)/dt is zero), 
This means you have an assymetry existing at all points of resistance 
in the circuit, provided your frequency of d(phi)/dt is above 60hz. For an example, you may have +100volts in one direction, 
But in the other direction...-30volts. Its a hard thing to wrap your brain around... 

 

To study the principle video below

 

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Hydrogen Hot Rod

This is really just a charge pump, it is 
Tesla 101, if you take out the spark gap 
And secondary side of a tesla coil schematic, this is 
What you get. The entire secondary builds over time, (provided 
You have a high insulative barrier between 
The secondary and the "outside world" once that is breached, 
Through an arc to the core, etc, you have reached your max. 
Notice how thick meyers insulation was between his coils and the core, 


How they were isolated etc.This document explains the circuit behaviour using a small signal model. 

A review of the Guanella 4:1 balun on a shared magnetic circuit. 

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Tips

 

Sometimes to learn how something works......we need to study it..high frequency pulsed DC into a transformer and study the blocking diode reaction, and the inductor reaction..........flux permability and back emf and many other things going on here. core saturation and flux fields are also very interesting. voltage peak to peak and pos and neg............so many things going on............how to learn what is not in the book.........do it........write your own bookferrite or iron...........its a core ...do what needs done  Max Miller

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Hydrogen Hot Rod

Frequency is the derivative of phase. Keeping the input and output phase in lock step implies keeping the input and output frequencies in lock step. Consequently, a phase-locked loop can track an input frequency, or it can generate a frequency that is a multiple of the input frequency. This latter property is used by Meyer’s GMS computer for resonant frequency synthesis.The tuned resonant frequency output of this sub-system is then sent to the Cell Driver Circuit.

Stanley Meyer Cell Driver Circuit
Stanley Meyer Voltage Intensifier Circuit

Common mode chokes and Stans circuits.

Common mode chokes see here:-
https://www.coilws.com/index.php?main_page=page&id=128

It is very interesting that you cannot overload a common mode choke even with 200 amps or more. There design is to trap unwanted currents travelling in circuitry by the use of two inductors and capacitors which are put to ground.


In my schematic you will see that normal ac current goes through the inductors and into the load in two directions as per a normal ac circuit. Common mode currents however travel in the same direction down both conductors and this energy loads both L1 and L2 simultaneously.

 

This traps any common mode currents in the circuit. When the ac changes direction or stops, the two coils offload their collected common mode currents into the caps which in tern discharge it to ground. It is interesting to note that the chokes that collect common mode current are designed to be self resonant at the frequency or an harmonic of the common mode current frequency. Isn't that interesting?


What if Stans network is laced with common mode current and replicates a common mode choke but instead of putting it to ground he collects the energy in the caps? You can then see why he would add the diode because the diode would forward bias the inductor output after they collapse. Isn't that interesting? See lower drawing.


So in essence you could have a forward biased circuit where you could use a very small load in its normal current phase and operation, allows lots and lots of common mode currents to be trapped in resonant chokes which discharge into caps.

Sound familiar?
Just saying. 

Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit
Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit

http://www.hottconsultants.com/pdf_files/APEC-2002.pdf


More interesting reading. Switch mode power supplies create masses of common mode currents. Some of Stans schematics show such switching. Is Stan creating common mode currents in his switching circuitry then filtering them into current chokes and finally caps?

 

So to make this work, all you need to do is build a switchmode power supply making sure you keep the ac wires between each transformer stage wide apart to futher encourage common mode currents.

 

The dirty switching of the bridge rectifier and transistors is what causes the currents. Transform your voltage into high tension and then measure what frequencies the common mode currents are peaking at which will probably be in the Mhz. Once you've estalished where they peak you can build two inductors that are resonant at that frequency. Everytime the transistor shuts down and we get zero voltage into the small load, the two inductors will collapse at their own self resonant frequency into the caps. Now why didn't we think of this before?

 

You could take any 50% duty cycle switchmode power supply that has a two inductor common mode choke, remove the circuit that shunts the collected current in the inductors to ground including its caps, put a bias diode like stans in the circuit then send the output of the chokes to a fuel cell.
All you would need is a shunting resistor across the output, that would be enough to collect enough of the common mode currents in the inductors.

 

UPDATE: I've been reading University papers about filtering common mode currents from pulse driven motors and switchmode power supplies. The two inductors in their filtering circuits are tuned at the resonant frequency of the main harmonics or common mode currents and get this:

 

THEY STEP CHARGE THE CAPACITORS AT THEIR OWN SELF RESONANT FREQUENCIES BEFORE THE CAPS DISCHARGE THE LOAD TO GROUND.
Ladies and gents, Meyer was charging his cells with harmonics not normal current. He's filtering the harmonics from his bridge rectifiers and transistors into his water fuel cells via a common mode current choke. 

 

tans circuit as it should look. The two inductors L1 and L2 are self resonant at the main common mode current frequency. When the switchmode power supply is powering the shunt resister at V1 of the pulsing stage, common mode currents are charging the two inductors L1 and L2 which is what we see in bog standard harmonic filtering.

 

When those two inductors see a change in current because the main pulse changes to v0, instead of losing their voltage to ground as per normal common mode filtering, they collapse their voltage into the fuel cell at their self resonant frequency (Mhz).

 

This step charges the cell on every phase. To stop the cell from conducting current or reaching dielectric breakdown, the adjustable spark gap sets the voltage maxima.


The cell can only ever spend what ever value the shunt resistor is set at plus what ever harmonic distortion is present. Its beautiful.
I think this really is the breakthrough, I really do and I can't see that it isn't to be honest

 

 

 

 

DvhwQ_MXcAY3WTi.jpg

 

 

NOtes

 

Nav, if you would, check my thoughts here and see if we agree on a "mode" of operation:

The idea is to create noise spikes from the switching of transistors.  We don't want to use much power in doing this so the duty cycle or pulse width should be very small.  Lets say the total average consumption is less than an amp at 12 volts.  Next, we collect these spikes via common mode chokes, rectify them with a diode and dump the energy into the water fuel cell, grounded on one side.  The main power source isn't grounded so there is no connection between it and the water fuel cell.  Essentially the power source is at a floating potential and since there is a diode in-place, the voltage can rise to extreme levels.  There really is no complete circuit, so obviously amps are restricted.  The only thing we need to be careful of is the dielectric breakdown of the insulation on the actual common mode choke.  If it can go to 20,000 volts, then this will be the potential voltage we can have across the cell.

I must say, I like it nav if I'm seeing this correctly.

 

We are currently investigating the harmonics from bridge rectifiers and switching transistors combined in switch mode power supplies. 
Basically, what happens is that harmonics in their varying degrees from the 1st harmonic to the 35th effect the efficiency of switching transformers and their subsequent digital networks quite a lot. One of those harmonics is the dominant harmonic in American 60hz supplies. All of those particular harmonics are related to the 120hz output of a bridge rectifier in the US and 100hz in the UK. Switchmode power supplies in the US build common mode current chokes into their network to remove the dominant harmonic which causes common mode currents, this consists of a toroid that has two inductors which are resonant at the dominant frequency they wish to remove.

 

When you place a shunt resistor or load across any switchmode supply, the chokes filter out the dominant harmonic and shunt it to ground through two capacitors. We strongly believe that Stan Meyer took such a device and instead of shunting the caps to ground he collected that energy into a larger apparatus. My research on this has already discovered that switchmode current mode chokes step charge capacitors in the exact same way as Stan's networks do. We believe there are also other harmonics caused by switching transistors that can be collected in the chokes. So basically we are going to utilize harmonics and instead of wasting them to ground, redirect them into a fuel cell. The cost of running such a device is the value of the shunt resistor or load you use and normal losses. I now strongly believe that the power trapped in common mode currents and their respective harmonics are what Stan Meyer was exploiting. 


Work is beginning on finding the dominant harmonics and common mode currents at the moment. This can be done by anyone. All you have to do is find a switchmode power supply that has the toroid inductors and place a scope probe across those inductors. That will show you the frequency of the dominant harmonic and also the self resonant frequency of the inductor. Once you know that, the world is your oyster. There are common mode currents and harmonics on any system whether it be mains supply or your own generator or altinator.

 

Just to add, it may well be a combination of several harmonics that create the common mode currents we are looking for. Either way, they are trapped in the inductors and those inductors will always be self resonant at a sub harmonic or harmonic of the 60hz rectified supply. 
In essence we are taking a 60hz supply and collecting all the echoes from rectifying it and trapping them in a current choke. Thats why Stan calls them resonant chokes, they do exactly as it says on the tin.

 

Also, here is something very interesting. I have all of Stan's schematics for all of his patents. You cannot find any device whatsoever that is designed to filter out harmonics, neither does he mention harmonics and common mode currents. Why?
If I was building a device to be as efficient as it could possibly be, my network would filter out unwanted harmonics and currents at some stage even in the VIC. Yet Stan totally ignores them, why?


Why would you ignore something that can ruin your network unless your network needed those harmonics to work? Think about it.
Stan is using the two most notorius devices known to man for creating terrible distortion of the voltage and signal which are bridge rectifiers and switching transistors yet he carries on with his switching networks without so much as a sniff of filtering. Just think about that.

 

 

All we may have ever needed are these: common mode current chokes.

 

The Following video is important as you can use these ferrite bead as Brad Shows as a Pick up coil if a resisitor is added to stop this effect circuit,  Also Note at Position 8.22 we have a very very cool example of a similar sigal as stan had on his alternator it is funny how these radio guys all do similar NOTE IT. 

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The only thing I would offer to those chokes:  Make sure they have really good insulation.  Don't wrap mag wire right on the core.  In those pictures I'd bet I could flashover with less than 1000 volts--no good.


So nav, I have a white-noise generator.  Do you suppose if I connected it to a big fast MOSFET and pulsed a resistive load by way of a well insulated common mode choke and used some high power pulse capacitors, do you think I might see something if I dump the capacitors into a simple water cell connected to ground?  Think it's worth a shot?

 

I was discussing options with a friend last night. Eric Dollard, TH Moray and Tesla talked about networks where current was at zero, impedance is very high and voltage takes over setting off towards infinity. Stan also mentions this kind of network. My friend suggested last night that if you have a situation where you have self resonant chokes which stop common mode currents at lets say for arguments sake a 2Mhz harmonic and are self resonant at that frequency; then why not ping them with 2Mhz of high voltage normal current?

 

As I see it, you don't need to do that and it is much easier to filter common mode current than it is normal current. A common mode choke because of the flux cancellation can never overheat no matter what voltage is sat across it. It can never suffer flux overload because of the way it is configured and the fact common mode currents travel down two conductors in the same direction rather than a conventional loop. This gives it an advantage over conventional current. 


Matt, my advice would be this: Create an high tention voltage of 600v via a switchmode design that incooperates a bridge rectifier and a switching transistor like Stans. Find out where the dominant harmonics are with a scope before they go into the VIC (we dont want any blown up scopes here). 


Once you find where these harmonics are, build a common mode choke that is exactly resonant at that harmonic which is toroidal like pictured and add the bias diode. When you filter out the harmonics, you will create a zero current, high impedance where voltage theoritically sets off towards infinity because current = zero.


Normally, this energy is put to ground when the switching transformer is at V0 but you can send it to step charge a fuel cell, but always remember the safety factor with high voltage. 


The best thing to do at this time also is to study switchmode power supplies in depth compared to Stans designs and gather as much information as you can concerning this. Study common mode choke operation and how they create a zero current, high impedance and infinite voltage situation.


Stay safe at all times. It is also interesting to note that in a switchmode power supply that is equipped with a common mode current choke that even when there is no load across the supply, the choke continues to filter out common mode current across its caps. Thats very interesting. May explain why Stans schematics never show a parallel load to the fuel cell, it may not need one. Common mode currents may well load up Stans two resonant chokes in a none conventional loop type manner. That remains to be seen.

 

Just to add: Remember that when the switching transistor is a V0 and the two resonant inductors begin to offload collected harmonics into a cell, there will come a point when the water will reach dielectric breakdown which is bad. Run a spark gap in parallel with the cell so that the spark gap will short out before the cell does.

 

Two modes of operation, mode one -  transistor switches on and causes harmonic noise which load up the inductors and pass through R4. This is the normal mode of operation and normal current passes. Mode two, high impedance, zero current infinite voltage condition: the transistors switch to off and the inductors ring at their own self resonant frequency into the cell, the cell is also resonant at that frequency. The cells consist of a dipole open ended antenna probably a quarter wave of the resonant frequency.

 

 

May be a few errors in the schematic but that is a bridge rectifier, i may have the diodes on it  mixed up.

 

Good Job Nav, 
I'm thinking we talked about Common mode before here. 
here is a link:

Common Core CHOKES  Link 



have a good look and see what you think. any how, keep going, the only way to know it test! 

~Russ 

 

Thanks Russ, I missed that due to it being in rather a large thread. Very interesting debate.
I'm interested to see how you could scale this process down into the spark plug size Stan had for his buggy.

 

I think if you were pinging the inductors with either an harmonic or pinging them with their self resonant frequency and the cell is also resonant by acting like a transmission line, one tube inside the other then we would be talking in frequencies of 400Mhz to a gig.
Instead of looking at common mode chokes designed for switching supplies maybe we should be looking at common mode chokes for stuff operating at UHF frequencies like TV's and radio equipment or the old analog cell phones.

 

Stans tubes resemble a resonant cavity band pass filter quite a lot. His whole system is looking to me like a filtering circuit from a transmission line maybe UHF.

 

The common mode chokes are designed to filter harmonics from the electronics and he's sending the filtered harmonics into a resonant cavity designed to filter frequencies from transmission lines. For example at 145Mhz the 3rd harmonic is 435Mhz which is a nuisance on repeaters so they use resonant cavity filters to get rid of them.

 

The filter is a tube inside a tube design like Stan's tubes. So all Stan does perhaps is create a strong 19th harmonic on say 20Khz which is 380Mhz, have his two inductors tuned to be self resonant at that frequency then send the signal into a resonant cavity filter tuned at that frequency. The walls of those resonant cavity filters create high voltage electric fields. 
 

Today I experimented with a common mode choke built into a 450Mhz transmission line, the choke was on a toroid. I built a tube in tube resonant filter and added it to the toroid inductor,

 

When I pressed transmit on my UHF walky talky the toroid filters are resonant at 450Mhz and filter the voltage into the tubes, my wire was too thick and too lossy to see a instant reply but has i held the key for longer periods I could see the capitance step charge and as soon as it passed one volt I got bubbles of gas appearing. Just hope I havn't wrecked my UHF transceiver. When you moved the antenna really close to the receiving cable the voltage shot up and more gas bubbles. 

 

Stan is definately using self resonant common mode chokes, whether he pings it with an harmonic or the actual resonant frequency of those chokes I don't know but I know this; if you build a resonant cavity filter properly and tune it to the inductors then you will build a large electric field on the tubes of that cavity.

 

Research continues......
BTW, my antenna on the roof is a colinear 2m/70cm job. When I connect my choke to the coax of that antenna and placed a bog standard capacitor across the choke, you can see the voltage climb on the cap from the 34mv line voltage to 700mv before it is overcome by resistive loss in the network, this is because the antenna is picking up transmissions which my choke filters and charges the cap with.

nice work testing Nav
"Stan is definately using self resonant common mode chokes"

i think your on the right track. 

Effects of Harmonics on Power Systems
Oct 1, 1999 Sankaran, C. | Electrical Construction and Maintenance


'A more serious condition, with potential for substantial damage, occurs as a result of harmonic resonance. Resonant conditions are created when the inductive and capacitive reactances become equal in an electrical system. Resonance in a power system may be classified as series or parallel resonance, depending on the configuration of the resonance circuit. Series resonance produces voltage amplification and parallel resonance causes current multiplication within an electrical system. In a harmonic rich environment, both types of resonance are present. During resonant conditions, if the amplitude of the offending frequency is large, considerable damage to capacitor banks would result. And, there is a high probability that other electrical equipment on the system would also be damaged'.

Harmonics at resonance produce massively high voltages which need to be put to ground and kept out of systems. 
In a series network of 250v, subsequent resonant harmonics can produce voltages of more than 10,000v where there is distributed even inductance and capacitance within the inductors.


Self resonant common mode chokes have these qualities in series resonant circuits and if the tubes are tuned to the same resonance they will be subjected to incredibly high voltages. Eric Dollard calls this 'an electrostatic takeover' when a condition occurs where current is zero, impedance is really high and voltage takes off towards infinity.
Voltage basically takes over your network.

 

What if there is a Air gap in the CORE ?
 

The study of 5Khz Mosfet and tuning into the resonant harmonics

 

Below we have screen shots of a Mosfet driven at 1 volt. The 50% duty cycle is nothing to write home about with just a dominant 3rd harmonic @ 15Khz but I want you to pay particular attention to the voltage amplitude of the fundamental frequency 5Khz especially when I steal the first harmonic with a band pass filter.


At 50% duty cycle there is no 10Khz harmonic to be able to choke out at all but as we progress up to 60% and then 80% duty cycle then the 10Khz, 15Khz 20Khz come out to play as a percentage of the 1 volt which are devided by current and diminish into nothing.


Now, look what happens at 20% duty cycle, we get the same harmonics but when I take away the 2nd harmonic of 10Khz with a band pass filter, the amplitude of the fundamental frequency remains the same.


This just proves we are throwing money down the drain with CMC chokes and that energy can be harnessed.
It is interesting to note that if you build a VIC and the chokes are self resonant at 10Khz you can tune your system into the self resonance of those chokes just by tuning the duty cycle in and out which creates more harmonics for you to use, those that understand my thread on the square law of voltage and harmonics in a current free algorythm will understand how important this is.


Mosfets hate being run unbalanced, the more unbalanced they run the more dirty they run and we get more energy to multiply into high voltages. A 45% duty cycle will create enough harmonics in coils to run into thousands of volts. A 20% duty cycle will throw it into 40,000 to 60,000 volts in resonant coils because the harmonic distortions go well beyond the 8th harmonic. 


Realistic harmonics would be 8th as a maximum but as you go up in voltage amplitude more harmonics come into the equasion.

@ 20% duty cycle the 2nd harmonic @ 10Khz is responsible for over 50% of the total distortion of the fundamental frequency.

 

Capture that frequency into a self resonant choke that has opposing magnetic flux fields and the voltage will be 90 degrees

out of phase with the cancelled current field. Send that voltage into a tuned transmission line and you will win.

The key to gas production, the hidden energy of the 2nd harmonic

 

Based on the schematic below and having read the patent and further studies on the architecture of transistors and mosfets in switching circuitry we can now determine which harmonic Stan created so that he can filter that harmonic into his chokes.
This morning I continued my studies of my mosfet but this time I subjected it to a frequency sweep to see where it performed most efficiently under a resistive load at 1v square wave duty cycle pulse. 


Mosfets are very grumpy little animals, they produce harmonics in some frequency bands and don't produce hardly any in other bands. The architecture of the chip is responsible for this and that architecture likes to vibrate at one band but hates others, mosfets also absolutely hate being switched at less than 50% duty cycle pulse. It screws up their balance and causes huge distortions in the architecture and its mathematical equasions. This is simple denomination factors where 10 devided by 3 always leaves a value the switch cannot deal with. If the switch is dealing with 12 devided by 3 it always operates better than when it cannot devide voltages correctly. When there is no common denominator the switch gets ugly and harmonics worsen.


Todays sweep of my switching revealed that this particular mosfet likes the band 0-11Khz but when we pass 11Khz there is a sharp drop in voltage amplitude reaching less than 50% of the voltage that was present at 5Khz by the time it reached 20Khz. It had a peak at 3.3Khz then a slight peak at 10Khz at 50% duty cycle. I'm beginning to see that there is something significant about these switches at 10Khz related to their architecture. They absolutely love running at 10Khz!
But the fun really starts when we start to reduce the duty cycle at 5Khz drive frequency

 


I have uploaded a picture of this process and you can see the 10Khz harmonics increasing when we start to narrow the pulse, 45%, 40%, 35%, 30% and finally 15%. You can see harmonic distortion of the 1v pulse amplitude at each stage.
What is so important about this and what does it have to do with Stans schematic?


You see, what Stan is doing is this: In mode one he pulses 2 optocouplers at 5Khz, one of which has a resistor in series, the other has the cell in series and current passes through both circuits through the water but without the resistor this cannot occur, the resistor is a 50w VP50k and causes a series shunt through the water. 


When those optocouplers switch off when they are running at 50% duty cycle the inductors have no voltage and there is no gas production. We know this because the mosfet only produces 10Khz when the duty cycle begins to narrow.
You see, Stan has stated in the patent that the drive circuit runs at 5Khz and the inductors are self resonant at 10Khz, in this case we can only load the coils with energy when there is a 10Khz signal present and the only way that can happen is when we narrow the duty cycle pulse width.


So gas will only begin to be produced when the duty cycle narrows and the self resonant chokes begin to filter 10Khz harmonic out of the mode one 5Khz drive frequency.


As he narrows the duty cycle pulse and produces more 10Khz harmonics the system naturally widens the gate period so that during that gate when the inductors collapse into the cell, their time period in which they do so is set by the pulse width, its a magnificent relationship.


The inductors are wound in such a way that they cancel the magnetic flux field and the voltage will be 90 degrees out of phase. When they offload their voltage into the cell they will try to become a series LC network but Stan's diode makes the voltage unidirectional, the inductors can load the cell but the cell cannot load the inductors. Step charge of the cell can be the only result.
This is just amazing to know and I hope everyone understands what is going on. It is so important to realise that as we narrow the duty cycle pulse the 2nd harmonic begins to dominate the circuit and the chokes will charge at this frequency.
I hope people can understand and if you have any questions just ask away.

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Remember when cancelling current in chokes there are 2 modes as in the picture. If your harmonics are common mode then they are wired one partcular way, if they are differential mode currents they are wired another way, this picture will help you. Stan has them both ways because sometimes his circuit is balanced and sometimes it is not.

The square law of voltage, harmonics and relationship to impedance.

 

Everyone at some stage must wonder where Stan Meyer, Nikola Telsa, Eric Dollard and Henry Moray get their respective 'extra' energy from. Well here is an explanation as to where it comes from and why we get it.
Ohms' law and Lens' law in classical electronics tells us that basically current in any equasion is a catalyst into a diminishing algorithm. All calculations that involve current diminish into infinity.


As a simple example of this we will look at the relationship of current and harmonics in the real world then look at their relationship in a free space model.


Applying Ohms' law to harmonics is relatively simple, we can work out perfectly each harmonic in terms of percentage of the original signal source, its loss in dbi throughout the harmonic scale and the voltage will diminish as a square law relationship with harmonic distortion devided by current. This will give you the calculations for dc resistance of a half  phase or impedance of the full phase of ac energy.


We know all this but lets see what happens in a free space mathematical model:
A free space mathematical model is a situation where we calculate the same laws but where there are no wires where current can enter the algorythm and so dc resistance and ac impedance are basically taken away from the equasion. This gives us an idea of what harmonics and its square law to voltage try to naturally achieve.


If you start with a wireless inductor operating at a certain frequency and the inductive value is equal to the capatitive value based on our knowledge of Ohms' law without harmonic distortion, the output voltage will remain equal to the input voltage because there is no catalyst to change the algorythm. This would also be the same in a wireless transformer because there is no current exchange.


Now lets examine harmonic distortion in the same model. If you create an input frequency that has a full range of harmonic distortions towards infinity, this is what happens.


If you have a wireless inductor of 5khz input frequency the output voltage devided by time is equal to the input voltage devided by time. If the input frequency is stopped and the wireless inductor vibrates at the second harmonic of 10Khz,  the equal capacitive and inductive nodes are doubled but are devided by the same amount of time. This doubles the output voltage. If there is a third harmonic it trebles it so on and so forth.
This will not stop until the harmonic distortions diminish but in a world with no wires the harmonics are infinite and their square law with voltage is also infinite.


So when current is zero and we cannot apply current into an equasion, if there are no harmonics present the output voltage will remain the same as the input voltage at a certain frequency but when harmonics are applied,  because of their square law with voltage, will double the input voltage at every harmonic level towards infinity.
If we come back to the real world of wires and resistance and reintroduce current into the equasion, Ohms' law will diminish the voltage back from infinity into reality and resistive loss.

 

How do we get around this?
We need to create a reality where current is no longer part of Ohms' law and where voltage takes off towards infinity square to harmonics. To do this, firstly we must cancel current. To cancel current we must make two opposing current fields cancel each other out so it is impossible for linear activity to take place.
If you build a series circuit that is fed by 5Khz input into a capacitor Ohm's law will apply for the loading of that capacitor, if you add a series inductor into that circuit and it performs with the capacitor, Ohm's law will still apply. You will not win!

 

If you build a choke that is self resonant at twice the input frequency, that is the second harmonic of the fundamental frequency and you build it with two inductors that are wound in such a way that they cancel the each others flux field out, when those chokes filter that second harmonic they will do so in a condition where current is not present in the algorythm of Ohms' law and they will double the input voltage.


Now, because current remains at zero, the third harmonic, the fourth harmonic and every possible harmonic in an infinite direction will also be filtered into those inductors and even though Ohms' law deminished them before they got inside the inductors in the wiring of the series circuit, it does not matter, even if the 7th harmonic was very weak it will still increase the input voltage by a factor of 7 and the 23rd harmonic will increase the input voltage by a factor of 23 and it will keep going towards infinity if the wiring of the series circuit allowed it to do so.


Now, getting the voltage out of the inductors into a load is a difficult factor that needs to be thought about. When those inductors collapse it is impossible for them to collapse in a linear motion, they can only collapse 90 degress out of phase with the current which has been cancelled by opposing flux fields. So we now have high voltage 90 degrees out of phase with current at each terminal of the inductors.

 

The only way to ensure that current doesn't come back into the algorythm is to match the condition of the inside of those inductors on the outside of the inductors. That means you match the real world impedance of the coils in the wiring to the cell and the cell also matchs the real world impedance or both match it together as one.

 

To match the coils impedance then it has to fall into its resonance too, so the total length of the wires and the tubes together must be just under a quarter wave of 10Khz because less than a quarter wave is capacitive in nature but above a quarter wave is inductive.

 

If you extend the impedance and resonance of the coils to the tubes, current cannot enter Ohms' law again. So what we are looking at is a shortened transmission line with little losses.


I hope this has given people a better understanding of how voltage sets off towards infinity and its square law to harmonic distortion and the importance of resonant impedance matched transmission lines.

 

 

It is important to read Stan Meyers patents and fully understand what is going on. If you look at the picture which Russ kindly supplied there are a few things going on that need to be explained.


Firstly, you notice nine switches which indicate that the outer tubes of the cell are wired in parallel through the switches. The inner tubes are wired differently, they are still in parallel but because he only switches the positive side, he uses a common ground for all nine inner tubes.


Right, about the brown staining of the tubes: There are two modes of operation in the VIC, the first one is based at 5Khz and is a normal mode of operation that uses the cell as a short circuit to pass current around the series circuit.

 

The second mode of operation is paracitic of the first mode in which harmonics starting at 10Khz and all subsequent harmonics that the series circuit allows are filtered into the two chokes then during the gate period are released at resonance into the cell but on the outside of the inner tube and the inside of the outer tube which remain shiney.

 

The staining is iron oxide and you can see it all over the top spacer.

 

That oxide has been caused because of the following effect: During normal mode which is mode 1 at 5Khz, current passes through the water in between the tubes with a skin effect using the outside surface of the inner tube and the inside surface of the outer tube.

 

During that ionic process, the rest of the tubes are coated in iron because of the anode and cathode effect of electrolysis. When mode 2 turns into a capacitance of high voltages the iron coating is blasted away with high speed Oxygen and Hydrogen molecules,

 

So in essence mode one coats the tube with iron but mode 2 removes it. However, the voltage field that causes the Oxygen and Hydrogen in between the tubes is restricted to that region and so the iron coating in the inside of the inner tube and outside of the outer tube will not be removed and that is exactly what we have. 


You also notice that the outer tubes have slots cut in them. This is the method he used to fine tune the tubes into resonance and the same technique is used for tuning resonant cavity filters that remove common mode currents from transmission lines. He uses a wiper arm inductor to vary this together with varying frequency when different amounts of tubes are used, the PLL follows these factors.


Now about the winding of Stans inductors. If we are removing common mode currents which contain the harmonics we are interested in then the inductors are would opposite on the same toroid core, this will cancel the flux field and current will be zero.


If there are harmonics present which are not common mode ie normal current harmonics then in order to filter those harmonics we would need to wind them the same way but I doubt that is the case. I believe that the strongest harmonics are common mode currents and I have captured these harmonics at 3khz with disastrous consequences because I didn't match their impedance and resonance properly and reintroduced current back into the equasion.

 

If there are ANY impedance spikes in your system they will flyback at the input or light the cell up like a Roman candle. I believe Ronnie has experienced this already like I have, remember to stay safe.

Here we see mode 1 ionic staining on the tubes and white spacer.
We see the inner tubes have a common parallel ground and the resonant filter

tuning slots cut in the outer tubes which indicate

Stans cells behave the same way as resonant cavity filters in a transmission line. 


There are so many people failing at replicating Stan's work it is unbelievable, the reason we are failing is because we do not understand this technology. We have all tried various different set ups with no success or maybe a little success,

 

I myself have theorised different possibilities and different ideas hoping to inspire a realization in someone, it is important to keep people inspired and keep them believing Stan's work can be done because this road is long.

This particular endevour is different however. It's different because members can now begin to grasp how Stan's networks operate. Not only that, because we are beginning to understand paracitic currents and how to store them in current chokes with muliplying voltage in a current free algorythm, you don't need Stan's schematics anymore.

 

You can design your own schematics that don't even operate fuel cells but other apparatus. The mathematical free space model shows us that voltage is square to the infinite path of harmonics when current is kept from the equasion. We know how to cancel current in bucking coils, cmc chokes and series current chokes but we don't know what to do with the voltage field and its working condition.

 


The working condition is the keys to the kingdom. Since 1970 we have been drilled and taught to keep away from cmc's and their respective harmonics at all cost and we've been shunting them to ground not even caring to think if they could be useful. We've been creating cmc chokes that cancel current with opposing flux fields and shunting out of phase voltage to ground without even understanding or measuring the energy we are wasting or looking at its potential. The reason we have done this is because we never realised that the voltage field needs a working condition to flourish that extends the current free algorythm from inside the inductor to the outside network. 

 


Yet we play around with transmission lines all day understanding perfectly the concept that the oscillator impedance must match the line and antenna impedance at 50 Ohms and that the antenna resonance must match the oscillator frequency or the whole transmission line will fail! 
If you know this information then you already have the keys to the kingdom where the inductor voltage is concerned.

 

You see, Stan takes the voltage from his chokes and matches their impedance with the line and the antenna, the antenna being his tubes. He matches the frequency of the chokes with his tubes so they are resonant and the whole thing acts like a shortened transmission line like Ronnie has being telling us all along.
But there is a difference, in a normal transmission line you need voltage and current to transmit, this system has no current so it cannot transmit but it will still act like a transmission line. If your resonant line and antenna (tubes) are cut just short of a quarter wave then they will become capacitive in nature and they will try to form a resonant series LC network with the inductors.

 

The problem is, Stan has placed a diode in the series circuit so the inductors will load the antenna but the antenna cannot load the inductors. That means that during every gate period when the inductors become self resonant the diode becomes a switch because it allows the inductors to charge the antenna but not the antanna to charge the inductors and there is only one thing that can happen from here on in - the inductors will step charge the antenna with no reply. Ain't that right Ronnie?


People messing around with flat plates - it will not work, people messing with tubes that are not capacitive and are not cut less than a quarter wave of the inductors self resonant frequency - it will not work, ain't that right Ronnie?


So to sum up this system: You need to create a series VIC circuit on a toroid with a secondary and two chokes connected to the fuel cell. The chokes will be self resonant at 10Khz and wound so that the flux fields cancel each other out. 

 


But here is a little secret about the chokes: The more windings on the chokes the higher the voltage will be at resonance of 10Khz. The reason is because there are more distributed C and L nodes and always remember our square law - when current = zero, voltage doubles at every harmonic level. So if you make your coils self resonant at 10Khz, 15Khz, 20Khz etc etc the voltage is expotential. Just make sure that you reach the minimum for resonance.

 

A coil that has 1500 windings that is self resonant at 15Khz will produce the same voltage as a  coil that has 4500 windings on and self resonant at 10Khz but when the latter coil vibrates at 15Khz, 20Khz, 25Khz the voltage takes off towards infinity square with harmonics.
The VIC operates in two basic modes:

 


Mode 1. Normal current passes through the VIC and through the cell at 5Khz provided by a dirty bridge rectifier and mosfet, this current is high enough to pass through the water. While this series current takes place the chokes are loading with cmc's all through the harmonic range related to 5Khz and its dirty harmonics.


Mode 2. When normal current shuts down from the dirty mosfet, the chokes sense a change in current and collapse at their own self resonant frequency into the tubes. Because there is no current available (the flux field is cancelled in the toroid) the voltage is 90 degrees out of phase and will enter any system that contains its working condition.

 

The line impedance and antenna are a impedance match as well as a resonance match, the chokes will try and form a series LC network with the tubes but we know the diode only allows it to go one way so it step charges the cell.

 

Based on my current free calculation minus losses in a less than perfect impedance match, also based up to the 23rd harmonic as being the last, wound on inductors that at are exactly double the input frequency is

 

126960v per second from 12v input @ 500ma in mode 1.
@ the 8th harmonic which is more realistic is 15360v per second
@ the 3rd harmonic 2160v per second
Those figures were based on a 20:1 step up transformer@ 500ma
At step up based on 40:1@ 1000ma the figures are:
@ the 3rd harmonic 4320v per second
@ the 8th harmonic 30720v per second.


If you allowed these voltages to enter an untuned network it will light it up like a firework.
Be very careful!

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The charge pump analogy is correct insofar as getting the energy into the cell. 

The next question is how do you get the water capacitor to oscillate at resonance ? You'll need more than one cell and hook it up right. I see a lot of discussion on the boards about parallel or series connection of the cells. 

Two positives and a common negative will do it. This circuit demonstrates the use of four DC caps to oscillate at resonance. Although the circuit serves a different purpose, it's used here to illustrate the use of DC cap hookup to get them to oscillate. Just like the Tesla oscillator. 

only thing i can see the isolated ground was used for was measuring with a scope probe. 

i still need to tune the transformer 
the frequency gen is ready, plenty of tuning i have there and the power supply is done. 

now to tune the transformer

I guess there are two answers to that, one 
schematic shows a center tap on the secondary 
connected to an isolated inductor, (voltage wave guide section of the tech brief) 
The other answer is, it isn't connected to anything, isolated 
meaning it is not electrically common with earth ground or 
the primary circuit.All the previous circuits like 8XA, 9XA showed a common electrical ground between the inductors and the FWBR. The later model multi-spool assembly also showed the inductors grounded. I'm going to try it both ways. At the very least there should be no harm in having common ground. 

Frequency Generator

 

You need a good on that  will never die. and a square wave that is razor sharp .

So you  can choose 50% duty or variable duty. turn the knob and watch the signal on the scope smooth. 

Use diferent drivers for different things. the driver is what handles the real power. the frequency gen is just 5 volt signal out. most all frequency gens will output 5 volt signal. like 100 mili amps. the trick is to pass the signal to the load, with no smoke.

 

So all my drivers are isolated from the signal frequency generator. some a driver.

 

 

 

 

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VIC replication in multisim. The circuit produces a step charging waveform and is a great learning tool. In the simulation you can change frequency, voltage, current, and any component Thanks, The cell needs to be a low capacitance (50-300nF). Delrin insulated coaxial tubes are best. I am trying to build as close to original specs as possible. Replication in multisim is simple but in real life it's an enormous challenge.Distilled Water The cell needs to be a low capacitance (50-300nF)?  How you you measure it?  With an LCR meter or RC Time Constant?  Can you adjust the Capacitance with the conductivity of the water,

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Explanation of the circuit I made to get variable amplitude pulsing during the 'Gate' time. In this video I stated I made this circuit for the PLL but forgot I actually made it after Ronnie (GPSSONAR) mentioned it was necessary to get the cells working. I'm going to be building this circuit again and I'll start running tests on it, once I get it working I'll probably make a PCB and if all goes well I'll share it here and on the forums. I forgot to mention but for the HF and LF pulsing I use a dual channel frequency gen that has adjustable duty cycle and bias as well as a sweep function. With this setup the circuit is adjustable in every way needed. This video is of the exact circuit- showing the operation on an oscilloscope:

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Adding the Digital Accelerator Pedal Input Control 

this will maintain the 3 sec gate but raise the voltage amplitude to primary and to cell .

 

We may want the overlayed gate voltage to raise as a Boost.or to run 2nd or 3rd vics 

 

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Backup and yes we have 4 to 5 backups you should immediately do same download it now be warned 

Backup and yes we have 4 to 5 backups you should immediately do same download it now be warned 

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I'm a paragrapAfter many revisions I finally have a good drive circuit for the VIC. This circuit has two pots, one for adjusting the primary coil voltage amplitude and another for adjusting the pulse voltage amplitude of the pulsing during the 'Gate' time. There are four options for driving the primary coil. 1. Gate time high-Current flows through primary coil during gate time 2. Gate time low-No current flowing through primary coil during gate time 3. Variable pulse voltage amplitude during gate time (via P2) 4. Continuous pulse frequency Both high (resonant) and low (gate) frequencies are provided by a FeelTech function generator which provides independent frequency, duty cycle, and sweep functions. The drive circuit, function generator and VIC coil are all powered by a Ryobi 18V battery and a programmable power supply as seen in previous videos. Sharing it here to help others who may be interested.h. Click here to add your own text and edit me. It's easy. FROM BRAD
Circuit Diagrram and bom 
BradK-Hybrid VIC Driver-April 2020 v2.png
Stanley Meyer  VIC Driver Circuit

 

Multiple VICS

 

One thing I thought about was this....The coil drive pulsing and gate pulsing were not synchronized.

 

So, having the VIC's all wired like that does not make sense to me because at times some VIC's would be off and others would be on, so some of the coils would be acting as loads and some would be acting as sources if they were connected as you have shown....

 

SOMEONE TELL ULF TO GET ON THESE FORUMS!that should not happen if the primaries are pulsed in parallel. each of them can have it´s own switch to handle their individual back emf but they are all pulsed by the same source generatoror bettereach primary gets it´s own pulse generator but those generators are all synchronized and only duty cycle of each primary can be slightly different to fine tune all serial transformers

 

(i don´t expect that Meyer had this equipment but with a single PGen pulse generator in phase shift lock mode you can easily perform that task for 4 primaries because it´s a built in standard feature).

 

Don GAble 

Dan, as you might already know, everything was in boxes. Nothing was hooked up to each other. If you look at the VIC control panel, you will see two round plugs. The top one is labeled "Fuel Cell", all of the out connections of the VIC coil packs came out of there seperately. You got to remember that the coil packs plugged into the VIC cards. They were both inside that control panel. Now how these were actually wired to the cell, we don't know for sure. I never seen any type of connection that went to the resonant cell. There were cables there that tied everything together, but I didn't have them when I brought it all home to test. We weren't able to find them at the time. My guess is that there was one VIC control card and coil pack for one tube set. Each one was probably wired seperately at first. Then Stan may have rewired them and made all the tube sets as one connection. I think that only one VIC card and coil pack ran all ten tubes, once they were wired in series. That's just my opinion, based on the scanning circuit of the VIC card. I don't think that you could wire more than one together, because of the scanning circuit. I don't think two of them could work in series or parrallel. There isn't any pictures showing a wiring connection goint into the resonant cavity, that could help us figure it out. Only that they were all wired in series.

VIC sequential firing

  • This is From Lynx RWG Forum Advanced Effort 

 

the idea with the sequential firing is that for every edge transition, both on the leading and on the trailing edge of the main operating frequency, one of four transistors are cut off, thus discharging it's associated transformers stored primary energy into the secondary, which in turn feeds the WFC through it's diode, all along the way as the other three transformers primaries are being charged, which means that three transformers are continously fully loaded and ready to fire when the time comes.

 

i still need to tune the transformer 
the frequency gen is ready, plenty of tuning i have there and the power supply is done. 

 

which could mean that at the correct frequency the natural ringing/oscillating of the secondary circuit will be enhanced regardless of which one of the transformers that's being discharged, only this time by a factor of 4, thus enhancing the stepcharge accordingly.Having seen the cells being attached in series on Meyer's own WFC I can't help but wondering if his VIC's were controlled this way, by firing 1 VIC while the rest of them were being charged.Why else the need of 10-11 VIC's if all the cells are connected in series?

 

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Voltage Regulation of the VIC CIRCUITS

VIC Voltage Circuit This interpretation was done by Max Miller

The Picture Below is of an inverter 10 to 15 volts go in DC,

 

To the transistors. the transistors are doubled up for handling maybe 30 amps.

 

Transistors are doubled because there 2 sets.

Each set is a push pull driver. into inductors to slow it down into the transformer..

This makes an AC current. then to the rectifier, converts it to DC again.

 

The reason this was done was ,a car alternator runs at 14.5 volts a car battery without the car running is 12 volts.

 

Under load of starter or hho cell, the battery could hit 11 or 10 volts. at this point the ignition coil, vic, injector

and vic would not operate correctly. Also, any 10 or 12 volt regulators in the circuitry would not be working correctly. 

 

This is because they have 2 volt voltage drops. so 10 volts would be seen as 8 volts so you see, this is a

voltage regulation device for the vic circuits not a water heater. 

 

The full wave bridged rectifier is a dead give away. you will also find its description in the birth of a new tech. paper 

it speaks of a voltage regulation circuit. the water heater does not use a full wave bridged rectifier

Voltage Regulation of the VIC CIRCUITS

VIC Voltage Circuit This interpretation was done by Max Miller

Stanley Meyer Power Supply
Stanley Meyer Power Supply

Notes From Max 

 

In the Example of a fuel cell circuit of Figure 2, a water capacitor is included. The step-up coil is formed on a conventional torroidal core formed of a compressed ferromagnetic powdered material that will not itself become permanently magnetized, such as the trademarked "Ferramic 06# "Permag" powder as described in Siemens Ferrites Catalog, CG-2000-002-121, (Cleveland, Ohio) No. F626-1205. The core is 1.50 inch in diameter and .25 inch in thickness. A primary coil of 200 turns of 24 gauge copper wire is provided and a coil of 600 turns of 36 gauge wire comprises the secondary winding. Other primary/secondary coil winding ratios may be conventionally determined. 

An alternate coil arrangement using a conventional M27 iron transformer core is shown in Figure 9. The coil wrap is always in one direction only. 

In the circuit of Figure 2, the diode is a 1N1198 diode which acts as a blocking diode and an electric switch that allows voltage flow in one direction ■ only. Thus, the capacitor is never subjected to a pulse of reverse polarity. 

The primary coil of the torroid is subject to a 50% duty cycle pulse. The torroidal pulsing coil provides a voltage step-up from the pulse generator in excess of five times, although the relative amount of step-up is determined by pre-selected criteria for a particular application. As the stepped-up pulse enters first inductor (formed from 100 turns of 24 gauge wire 1 inch in diameter), an electromagnetic field is formed around the inductor, voltage is switched off when the pulse ends, and the field collapses and produces another pulse of the same polarity; i.e.. another positive pulse is formed where the 50% duty cycle was terminated. Thus, a double pulse frequency is produced; however, in a pulse train of unipolar pulses, there is a brief time when pulses are not present. 

By being so subjected to electrical pulses in the circuit of Figure 2, water confined in the volume that includes the capacitor plates takes on an electrical charge that is increased by a step charging phenomenon occurring in the water capacitor. Voltage continually increases (to about 1000 volts and more) and the water molecule starts to elongate. 

The pulse train is then switched off; the voltage across the water capacitor drops to the amount of charge that the water molecules have taken on, i.e. voltage is maintained across the charged capacitor. The pulse train is then reapplied. 

Because a voltage potential applied to a capacitor can perform work, the higher the voltage potential, the more work is performed by a given capacitor. In an optimum capacitor that is wholly non-conductive, zero (0) current flow will occur across the capacitor. Thus, in view of an idealized capacitor circuit, the object of the water capacitor circuit is to prevent electron flow through the circuit, i.e. such as occurs by electron flow or leakage through a resistive element that produces heat. Electrical leakage in water will occur, however, because of some residual conductivity and impurities or ions that may be otherwise present in the water. Thus, the water capacitor is preferably chemically inert. An electrolyte is not added to the water. 

In the isolated water bath, the water molecule takes on charge, and the charge increases. The object of the process is to switch off the co-valent bonding of the water molecule and interrupt the sub-atomic force, i.e. the electrical force or electromagnetic force, that binds the hydrogen and oxygen atoms to form a molecule so that the hydrogen and oxygen separate. 

As noted initially, the capacitance depends on the dielectric properties of the water and the size and separation of the conductive elements forming the water capacitor. 

EXAMPLE I In an example of the circuit of Figure 2 (in which other circuit element specifications are provided above), two concentric cylinders 4 inches long formed the water capacitor of the fuel cell in the volume of water. The outside cylinder was 0.75 inch in outside diameter; the inner cylinder was 0.5 inch in outside diameter. Spacing from the outside of the inner cylinder to the inner surface of the outside cylinder was .0625 inch. Reasonance in the circuit was achieved at a 26 volt applied pulse to the primary coil of the torroid at 10KHZ, and the water molecules disassociated into elemental hydrogen and oxygen and the gas released from the fuel cell comprised a mixture of hydrogen, oxygen from the water molecule, and gases formerly dissolved in the water such as the atmospheric gases or oxygen, nitrogen, and argon. 

 

==================================

An alternate coil arrangement using a conventional M27 iron transformer core is shown in Figure 9. The coil wrap is always in one direction only. 

this says you can change cores...........even iron.............there is no way an iron core will hit its Q at 10khz............mine did at 500hz.........480hz really

==================================

the diode is a 1N1198 diode which acts as a blocking diode and an electric switch that allows voltage flow in one direction ■ only. Thus, the capacitor is never subjected to a pulse of reverse polarity. 


any fast diode of the correct voltage and amperage should work 

its just a diode 

10khz is slow, really...........not so fast anyway

==================================

step-up from the pulse generator in excess of five times, although the relative amount of step-up is determined by pre-selected criteria for a particular application 

200 to 600 turns....pulsed, it says steps up 5 times 
thats what i got....24 volts to 150 

it will change to different turn counts....it says..........common sense..... he is saying change it, it you want........

==================================

As the stepped-up pulse enters first inductor (formed from 100 turns of 24 gauge wire 1 inch in diameter), an electromagnetic field is formed around the inductor, voltage is switched off when the pulse ends, and the field collapses and produces another pulse of the same polarity; i.e.. another positive pulse is formed where the 50% duty cycle was terminated. Thus, a double pulse frequency is produced; however, in a pulse train of unipolar pulses, there is a brief time when pulses are not present. 

first inductor...............means there must ne more then one............one on pos and one on neg, i would say..............he tricked us............ 

the pulsing fiends forms 2 pulses, as ronnie had said.... 

pulse train...........he means there is a gate............another trick 

there is a brief time when pulses are not present...............again he tells you there is gate............ 

he is hiding the secret in plain site.................words confuse and get missed, yet they are there............he told the truth and yet hid it

=============================

the capacitor plates takes on an electrical charge that is increased by a step charging phenomenon occurring in the water capacitor. Voltage continually increases (to about 1000 volts and more) and the water molecule starts to elongate. 

here is the obvious.....................with the cell attached you must hit at least 1000 volts for the reaction to start 

thats just the start............. 

i would guess that is one tube set, per 1000 volts.................tubes in parallel would all raise at the same time, maybe..........tubes in series..........i can not grasp it doing that..........but who really knows

=====================================

 

The pulse train is then switched off; the voltage across the water capacitor drops to the amount of charge that the water molecules have taken on, i.e. voltage is maintained across the charged capacitor. The pulse train is then reapplied. 

thats the charge pump.............dependent on the correct workings of the pulse train 
you must be tuned correctly for it too function...........everything

======================================

Because a voltage potential applied to a capacitor can perform work 

high voltage potential............not amps.............this does not mean you use zero amps to make it work...............thats impossible 
you have to use real physics............in real physics...some things are always there.......... 
the vics in the car where on 5 amp fuses..............that is a no brainer..............they make 3 amp fuses.........he used 5 amp fuses

========================================

as noted initially, the capacitance depends on the dielectric properties of the water and the size and separation of the conductive elements forming the water capacitor. 
this says...........change shit and shit changes.......... 
obviously there was shit in the water and tubes can vary in size and shape

=========================================

Reasonance in the circuit was achieved at a 26 volt applied pulse to the primary coil of the torroid at 10KHZ, and the water molecules disassociated into elemental hydrogen and oxygen and the gas released from the fuel cell comprised a mixture of hydrogen, oxygen from the water molecule, and gases formerly dissolved in the water such as the atmospheric gases or oxygen, nitrogen, and argon. 

obviously he says it was resonance at 10khz..............for that toroid made of ferrite.............. 



mixture of hydrogen, oxygen from the water molecule, and gases formerly dissolved in the water such as the atmospheric gases or oxygen, nitrogen, and argon. 

obviously it is natural water................

================================

surely everyone can work with that information................ 

now get to work...........and do not forget...............this is the real forum.........that is doing the work. 

i had better not catch anyone looking in and going back to other forums, telling what they found with out saying where it came from........ 

and believe me.........i will know. 

there is no reason why people can not post there work here, when the found work here. share and share alike 

ris pointed that info out.............he is helping 
ronnie helped....... 

come on guys............show the world what your made of!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

=====================================

Don & Max 

Are you seeing double the frequency at the load, compared to the frequency into the primary? 
How is it that your scope also shows positive voltage out of the choke at the load? I never see that with my set up. 
I'm using an isolated transformer to power up my equipment. The isolated transformer has been modified to separate the earth ground from the neutral leg on the secondary side. 
I have my equipment back together and have done some initial testing. Looking to do a video today to show my results. 
Don

 

as long as the secondary is not grounded, its the same as isolated ........the transformer becomes your isolation transformer. if you were to ground the secondary to the primary............then it is not an isolated ground...... 

unipolar pulse train....................... thats what stan always said..............if you can not get the pulse on the pos side...........you will never get a charge pump. or step charge. 

if your scope is not an isolated ground..........you may be grounding out the neg probe to the transformer and the wall outlet. 

this is a 4 channel isolated ground scope.........all channels are isolated from each other and the wall......they are cheap........3 to 5 grand

 

=============================

MISC INFO FOR BASIC REFERENCE NOT METHOD

 

ok this is for adys15 

i got a beautiful step charge with that simple coil 
24 volts in....2 amps 
one tube set was 22 volts 

10 tube set was 95 volts....series connection 
some bubbles  and i tell you............it is not done............

 

 

The problem with that board is, it was meant to be plugged into the VIC coil pack, and it also ties into the GMS control panel. I'st part of a whole system. That board alone is only one piece of a larger puzzle. I think it's meant to be seen as a copy of Stans original one. It would require a lot of bypassing to make use of it. Just like I had to do when I tested Stans original. 
It is a nice copy though. 
Don

 

yes, we have made the bypass as well. the gate has to go into it for one. 
it is exactly what the other one was. whatever the one did. this one will as well

 

the circuit you see is just a pulsing circuit. pulsed into the vic. the feedback auto adjusts the frequency. 

don had the original on, and made few bubbles. it is not as simple as just make the same circuit as he made. it is a relationship to the pulse and what is being pulsed. how the cell reacts and how the pulse reacts and how the inductors fit in. 

its like knowing how a v12 engine works and building the same. some details take some time to figure out. where does the timing chain get set. the valve lash? injector timing? what if the valve has a leak? what about back pressure on the combustion chamber? 

it is not as simple as build tubes, build vic, build circuit 

there are many small details, that matter hugely. Max 

Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit Card

Picture Below

this is the driver for the vic 
in that board, it is there 
end of discussion............no not really 
in that board also is a variable voltage driver....... 
end of discussion.......no not really

Stanly A Meyer Vic Driver H Bridge

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Stanley A Meyer Vic Divr H Bridge

obviously we can see a voltage changer, and the pulse into the pnp transistor would be the inverse of the pulse into the npn transistor at the end

Stanley Meyer Voltage Intensifier circuit

Thanks the hand drawn board is very useful.  It does a nice job of showing all the off board connections and had the landing spot for the upper end of the patch.  I believe the all the switch does is select which analog signal goes to the test point.

The first picture I circled the patch in yellow you can see where the upper line disappears on the capacitor.  You can also see lower capacitor is part of the patch (hump in circle)

In the second hand drawn picture I circled the landing point of the upper wire in brown.  This was the piece I was missing still not sure if anything else is on that landing point.  I had traced the wires from the switch to the upper landing pad just did not know what was on them.  Make sense now.

You can also see in hand drawn to the left of this patch the big red wire that is also a patch to the power.  Need to check to see it this still needs to added.

Thanks the hand drawn board is very useful.  It does a nice job of showing all the off board connections and had the landing spot for the upper end of the patch.  I believe the all the switch does is select which analog signal goes to the test point.  The first picture I circled the patch in yellow you can see where the upper line disappears on the capacitor.  You can also see lower capacitor is part of the patch (hump in circle)  In the second hand drawn picture I circled the landing point of the upper wire in brown.  This was the piece I was missing still not sure if anything else is on that landing point.  I had traced the wires from the switch to the upper landing pad just did not know what was on them.  Make sense now.  You can also see in hand drawn to the left of this patch the big red wire that is also a patch to the power.  Need to check to see it this still needs to added. Brown Circle missing connection part.png
Stanley A Meyer Vic PCB Patch diagram
Stanley A Meyer VIC Circuit

A small heads up... the quad bilateral switch within the PLL section on the VIC board says 4066 - but in ^ photo and don's drawing it is a 4016 Well i realized the 4066 is basically identical to the 4016

Stanley A Meyer VIC Voltage Intensifier
Stanley A Meyer VIC Voltage Intensifier
Stanley A Meyer VIC Voltage Intensifier
Stanley A Meyer VIC Voltage Intensifier
Stanley A Meyer VIC Voltage Intensifier
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4a2befe77061cc9d1045e27e57aaa29f.png
c387d2c9adbd17791ab6a9655fd447a3.png
9a5bfdd57f4ad9d9972857f0d7585e95.png
c841b4d89a8a022209a70ffec347ee15 (1).png

BILL OF MATERIALS 

 

QTY Full   Board Reference Full   General Description   Value
 

IC CIRCUITS    
5   A23   LM731P OP AMP   
   A24   LM731P OP AMP   
   A25   LM731P OP AMP   
   A26   LM731P OP AMP   
1   A27   4046-PWR    4046 - PHASE LOCK CHIP   
4   A28   4017 DECADE COUNTER    
   A29   4017 DECADE COUNTER    
   A30   4017 DECADE COUNTER    
   A31   555 CHIP TIMER   
   A32   LM731P OP AMP   
   A33   LM318 OP AMP   
1   IC1   4001N   QUAD 2 -INPUT NOR   
1   IC2   4066N   QUAD BILATERAL ANALOG SWITCH   
2   IC2   4001N   QUAD 2 -INPUT NOR   


 

CAPACITORS   
1   C1   470nF   
   C2   100nF   
   C3   100nF   
   C4   100nF   
   C5   100nF   
1   C6   10uF   35 volt polarized capacitor
1   C7   47pF   
1   C8   300nF   
3   C9   1uF   
   C10   1uF   
   C11   1uF   
   C14   .1uF   
   C15   100nF   
1   C16   35nF   
   C17   10uF   16 volt non polarized capacitor
   C18   100nF   
   C19   100nF   
   C20   100nF   
   C21   100nF   
   C22   100nF   
2   C23   .1uF   
13   C24   100nF   
   C25   100nF   
   C26   100nF   
   C27   100nF   
2   C28   10uF   16 volt non polarized capacitor


Diodes    
1   D1   1 KV 5 AMP SPEC    
1   D2   1N405   
3   D3,D4,D5   1M4001   
2   D6,D7   1N4148   

 


Transisitor   
3   Q1,Q12,Q16   2N2222   
2   Q6,Q8   2N3906   
1   Q7   2N3904   


Resistors    
   R1   10K   
   R2   10K   
   R3   10K   
   R4   10K   
   R5   1K   
   R6   1K   
   R7   470K   
   R8   470K   
   R9   10K   
   R10   47K   
   R11   22K   
   R12   1K   
   R13   470K   
   R14   1K   
   R15   470K   
   R16   470K   
   R17   ??   
1   R18   440K   
1   R19   2.21K   
1   R20   2.21K   
   R21   100K   
1   R22   1M   
   R23   10K   
   R24   10K   
   R25   100K   
   R26   100K   
   R27   560K   
   R28   27K   
   R29   4.7K   
   R30   10K   
   R31   10K   
2   R32   22K   
   R33   2K2   
   R34   470K   
   R35   2K2   
7   R36   470K   
3   R37   2K2   
5   R38   1K   
2   R39   47K   
1   R40   10M   
10   R41   10K   
   R42   220K   
2   R43   220K   


 

Potentiometers   
1   Potentiometer  Panel Mount Through Hole   50 kOhms 500 mW (1/2 W)   https://th.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Honeywell/392JA50K/?qs=%2Fha2pyFaduhDOCKt20U9cFcOvaq0S9kP20pqEwlrYeHG1yY04GUTjA==
1   FREQ - ADJUST     100 K 3296 TRIMM RESISTOR FOR 4046   
1    POT 1      50 K  CONDUCTIVE PLASTIC RESISITOR    
1    POT 2       50 K  CONDUCTIVE PLASTIC RESISITOR    
3     MANUAL       50 K  CONDUCTIVE PLASTIC RESISITOR    
      LED'S   
1   OSC LED           GREEN   5 mm DIFFUSED    
2   LOCK ON          RED     5 mm DIFFUSED  

 

 
 IC SOCKETS    
6   8 pin   ic socket   8 pin    ic socket   
4   16 pin    ic socket   16 pin    ic socket   
3   14 pin    ic socket   14 pin    ic socket   
         
         
TOGGLE SWITCH   

on on 2 position   10A 125 VAC

on on 2 position   10A 125 VAC

on off on 3 position   10A 125 VAC
         
test connector   
1   bnc test  connector pcb through mount   bayonete fitting   
         
Fuse Socket    
1   fuse mount fuse holder    through hole black   

If and when people see how the water bath is charged only then will they understand how it is charged.
Why people keep trying to throw voltage to the cell is beyond me.
Let the vic do it's job and and set up the process to produce ions in the water bath.
There were only 1 Vic ever hooked up and used in the VIC unit. One battery voltage and signal connection and 1 cell output for 1 Vic. 
There is one another Battery voltage and signal exposed.
Here is the proof that 1 was ever hooked up. This is the back of the VIC Unit, They are circled in yellow in the photo.
The rest of the vic connections and battery voltages has shrinkable tubing over them for protection.

All I was trying to do is show that the VIC's did not need to be hookup that way.

Stanley A Meyer VIC

From looking at the photo, one can only conclude that 2 vic's were ever hooked up in that unit.
There is 1 battery voltage and signal connection that is straight across to a cell connection.
There is also 1 battery voltage and signal connection that has no cell connection across from it.

What this tells me is there was 1 for the fuel cell and 1 for the gas processor.
Everyone can make their own conclusions about this. I am only expressing my own.

You have to think about what all is on the buggy is to why there is so many vic slots.
1: Fuel Cell
2: Steam resonator
3: Electorstatic water filter
4: Gas processor
5: Who know's what else Stan had in his mind.


They all take vic's, and they all in my mind are resonate cavities. So don't let the labels on the front panel fool you.
The Steam Resonator and Gas Processor is the only two that are Labeled, other than other resonate cavity slots.


Also if you were building this would you not be thinking ahead if you needed to add another cell for larger engines other than a 4 cylinder.


As someone said, everything Stan built was for proof of concept, I agree 100%. Everything he built was to be shrunk down into a small package once things were proven to work.
Do your homework and research.

 

As far as the water injector plug, This is were people are mixing all the technologies together with the water fuel cell technology.
In the water fuel cell tech, the laser distributor used the regular coil and points inside the distributor for the spark for the spark plug. The laser distributor in this technology was used only for the timing of the injection of the gas to enter the cylinder.

In the Water injector plug technology, There was another laser distributor and it not only sent a signal to the GMS Unit for gas injection it also sent a signal to the water injector VIC which is a stand alone Vic and is not part of the VIC Unit for spark ignition timing

Kits and Parts List

VIC Kits and Parts

Stanley Meyers VIC Original PC
Stanley Meyers VIC Original PC
Hydrogen Hot Rod
Stanley Meyers VIC BOM List
Stanley Meyers VIC BOM List

This board  was meant to be plugged into the VIC coil pack, and it also ties into the GMS control panel. I'st part of a whole system. That board alone is only one piece of a larger puzzle

.It requires  bypassing to make use of it. yes, we have made the bypass as well. the gate has to go into it for one. it is exactly what the other one was. whatever the one did. this one will as well

 

The circuit you see is just a pulsing circuit. pulsed into the vic. The feedback auto adjusts the frequency.

Don had the original on, and made few bubbles. it is not as simple as just make the same circuit as he made. it is a relationship to the pulse and what is being pulsed. how the cell reacts and how the pulse reacts and how the inductors fit in.

 

 

Successful Voltage Intensifier Circuit Board Replications 
Stanley A Meyer VIC circuit
Stanley Meyers VIC circuit
Stanley Meyer VIC circuit
Stanley Meyers VIC circuit
Stanley Meyers VIC circuit

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Stanley Meyers VIC circuit
Stanley Meyers VIC circuit
Stanley Meyers VIC circuit
Stanley A Meyer Vic Circuit Wiring Loom

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​GMS UNIT EMS ECU STANLEY MEYER
​GMS UNIT EMS ECU STANLEY MEYER
​GMS UNIT EMS ECU STANLEY MEYER

In general, a phase lock loop (PLL) is a control system that tries to generate an output signal whose phase is related to the phase of the input “reference” signal.It is an electronic circuit consisting of a variable frequency oscillator and a phase detector.This circuit compares the phase of the input signal (COM A from the Adjustable Gated Pulse Frequency Generator, fig. 6) with the phase of the signal derived from its output oscillator (Cell Driver Circuit, fig. 5). Note that the system can monitor the PLL output oscillator by way of COM H received from the Pulse Indicator Circuit (fig. 9).

​GMS UNIT EMS ECU STANLEY MEYER

The circuits in figures 7 and 8 interchange through COMs E, F and L.

​GMS UNIT EMS ECU STANLEY MEYER

The circuit then adjusts the frequency of its output oscillator to keep the phases matched.The signal from the phase detector is used to control the oscillator in a feedback loop.

​GMS UNIT EMS ECU STANLEY MEYER

Frequency is the derivative of phase. Keeping the input and output phase in lock step implies keeping the input and output frequencies in lock step. Consequently, a phase-locked loop can track an input frequency, or it can generate a frequency that is a multiple of the input frequency. This latter property is used by Meyer’s GMS computer for resonant frequency synthesis.The tuned resonant frequency output of this sub-system is then sent to the Cell Driver Circuit.

Stanley Meyer Cell Driver Circuit

This resulting energization is applied to the VIC to create the physical gas production effects in the resonant cavity enclosure.

Stanley Meyer Voltage Intensifier Circuit
Stanley Meyer PLL and Resonant Scanning

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GMS Mapping vic sction 2.jpg
Stanley A Meyer Vic Circuit
GMS Mapping vic sction.jpg

Hot Rod Cell Hacks 

Some thing to keep in mind when dc bounce starts and trys to become ac stopping gas production , his may aid the dc  to remain.

Pickup Coil

Well I wound both the feed back coil and the primary. 

 

I measured the length of the wire based on the manufactures ohms per foot then  cut wire to nearest 10ft mark on the high side. 

 

I then wound the wire on the spool and cut off wire until I got the desired ohm value.  Note:  As this is a low ohm value resistance of the leads on the meter needs to be taken into account.  Mine are about 0.2 ohms. 

 

After winding coils a when back to pictures in forum so see which way to hook up the primary.  I had forgot what the S and F labels meant S - Start and F - Finish also the Dot goes on with S and direction of wind only then needs to be the same to keep the Dot on the same side.   I had initially wound both coils clockwise start from the right side. 

 

While this would work it did not match the picture and to avoid confusing myself when hooking things up.  I rewound both coils clockwise but starting from left side of spool.

Interesting the feedback coil has 600 turns for 11.5 ohms and the primary 680 for 10.5 ohms. 

My next question was how does the primary coil hooked up to the VIC circuit. 

 

 The Project Icoros diagram I have showing bobbin size, coil layout and information on turns and ohm values also label S as - and F as + so I checked my VIC outputs where the primary will be connected with a volt meter. 

 

The Analog side is + so the F side of coil will be connected to it.   The Digital side was - so the S side of coil will be connect to it (- side also has the 5A1KV connect to it).

Now I do not think primary coil cares which way it is hooked up as the flux with cycle in both directions.  Still I wanted to define how I hooked it up so I have a base line.

The Project Icoros diagram also labelled feedback S as + and F as - so I will use these setting as the initial connections for the inputs to K14. 

Next step will be wind the secondary coil as it is on the same frame.  It then plan to do tests with primary and feedback coils without the secondary hooked up.

Purpose of that test is to take a look at signals to primary coil and allow me to do initial testing of the feedback circuit which I have not been able to do.

Wound the primary coil 680 turns for 10.5 ohms estimate was 128.31 ft.  I wound it slightly longer then took off wire until I had the desired ohms.

Then I wound the secondary coil estimate was 884.74 feet.  I again would slightly longer and took off wire until I had the desired ohms.  It took 3150 turns.

I am not sure it this will give the correct turns ratio, but this is what I got with configuration I am using.  Have been wondering how to adjust ratio if not correct.   As I have said before coils are not my thing I can wind them not sure I understand them.

In the process of adding leads to hook up primary and feedback coils to circuit boards.  I ran out of solder I though I had another tube turns out it just the tube.

I also purchased some brass shim stock from Amazon to use as spacers for the gap between the cores. Ronnie recommended bass or copper in one of his posts when he was talking about adjusting the phase difference between the two chokes.

Goodson Brass Shim Stock Assortment | 5 Pack | 4 x 6 in. | .001.002.003.005 and .010 in. Thick

I do not recall anyone providing an estimate of what the gap size should be.  Ronnie talked about changing by .001 but only one side but not what total gap should be.  Not sure how to test to determine proper gap size.

Note:  I designed my setup to allow the ferrite pieces on each side to be easily slid out so I can easily change the spacers.  Plan is to have a screw on one or both ends of tube to keep pressure on spacers and ensure there are no other gaps between the pieces.

Picture shows the Primary on right Feedback in Middle  and Secondary on left before wrapping with tape.  Primary has temporary tape to keep wire in place while winding other two coils.  I have added pig tails to Primary and Feedback but have not yet put on shrink-wrap tape to protect solder connections. It also has the brass plates I will cut down for spaces.

Plan to use a resistor on secondary for initial testing as I want to take a look at wave forms and make sure feedback coil is working properly before making coke which will both be on other tube. 

Stanley A Meyer VIC Pri Sec Feed Back coils

Finished winding Primary, Feedback and Secondary Coils.  See Picture  have added leads and put cores in tube.  Currently no gap. 

 

For reference I place end tubes, one with cores, and other side in photo.  I plan on doing some testing with just the finished side to see wave forms. 

 

I want to verify that Feedback works before I get to far.  After that test I plan on hooking secondary up to a resistor to check that is working and to again check wave form. 

 

At that point is should be the same as primary output with higher voltage.

One of the tests I plan on doing is to see what the gap does does to the output of the secondary.

Stanley A Meyer VIC Pri Sec FB with lead

I am posting preliminary Feedback Coil tests to show the wave form out of the coil to the Pulse Sensing Board.  So this would be input to that board. 

 

The main board frequency generator is not currently working correctly so it is putting out 41.67Hz pulse.  I believe that is also causing the large bump and start of each pulse.  I will post updated traces later.  Also no choke in system at this point just primary, secondary and feedback coils.

Photos show both the positive and negative pulse out of the feedback with both the digital and analog signals.  I only have a duel channel scope so can not get all three signals on the scope at the same time.

The scope with the purple trace is the math function A-B for the positive and negative FB signals.  I did this as this is the function performed by the Op Amp on the pulse board to generate signal going to Resonance Sensing board.

Note:  The 5v offset in the FB pulses (required as the GND reference on pulse sensing board is 0v instead of -12v).

The sensing load of the Pulse board on the feedback coil is tiny but the impendence load of FB coil is part of the load on the primary along with the secondary and chokes.  

Stanley A Meyer VIC Pri Sec FB with lead
Feed Back coil Neg with Analog.
Stanley A Meyer Feed Back  Coil Neg with
Feed Back coil  with Math.
FB Coil with Math.JPG
Stanley A Meyer Feed Back Coil Pos with
Stanley A Meyer Feed Back Coil Pos with
Stanley A Meyer Feed Back Coil Neg with

Each vic would see the same voltage as I do not believe there is any connection between them so the voltage on the feedback coil in each vic should be the same.  Unless you are using special wire none of the coils are going to handle the extremely high voltage.  I know the the wire I am using that the insulation breaks down around 10kv.  There was a lot of comments about wire insulation in forum as most wire is double coated but we may need quad coating to handle high voltage and it does not seen to be commonly available.

As the windings on the feedback coil and the primary coil are very close I would expect the voltage level to be very close to voltage on primary as it is almost an 1 to 1 ratio.  Remember voltage level on feedback coil is determined by flux level as there is no electrical connection.

The output of the pulse board needs to be at 12v logic level, though the information in the signal is the current operating frequency.

What I did not show in the pictures above is that feedback coil does pick up the high frequency pulses on the top of the AM wave.  I have problem in my system so I could not get that scope shot when I capture pictures above. 

Some good news.  LM-318 chips I ordered arrived today (this is the equivalent replacement for the 918m).   They were $2 each from Fair Radio Sales I needed to order 5 as they have a $10 minimum.  I plugged it into socket of Pulse board and it worked as I hoped.  I now for the first time have a full working Pulse Indicator board.  I took another series of photo with new board in system.

Another piece of good new for me is I had noise in my K21 Phase Lock Circuit.  I could see it on the gate input, it was there when gate input hooked up but was gone when I look at gate input disconnected from K21.  This appeared to be causing problems with the circuit operation properly.  While trouble shooting I happen to notice that pin 8 4001, chip ground, was not in the socket.  I remove the chip, straighten the pin and reinstalled it.  I double checked that each pin was properly seated.  This solved my noise problem.  You can even see in picture below that bump on front of digital signal is now gone.

I retook screen shots see below:  I kept primary input to primary coil as reference for all four photos Yellow trace.
The first shows inputs to primary coil.  Yellow is digital signal and blue analog signal.
Second shows digital signal to primary and  blue plus output of feedback coil, plus input to Pulse Indicator circuit.
Third shows digital signal to primary and  blue negative output of feedback coil, negative input to Pulse Indicator circuit.
Fourth shows digital signal to primary and blue output of Pulse Indicator circuit.  This shows that the feedback coil is tracking the digital signal.

This is the first time I had the Pulse Indicator Circuit working and have this operation input to K21.  In the photo you can see that both signals are at the same frequency, though they are jumping around some on the screen.  As note the change in scale on the blue trace as the this input is at 12v logic level to K21. 

Not show here is I quickly checked the switch on front of K21 which selects the different frequency ranges.  With the problems I had  with K21 this was not working before, it is now.  Before only position 4 gave me a frequency now all four positions do.

Now that I have a working and tested Pulse Indicator board I will post the test results and analysis of the board just to be complete. The last photo below however is the main result and will be included in that report.


 

Stanley A Meyer Pulse Indicator Output w
Stanley A Meyer Updated Digital and Anal
Stanley A Meyer Updated Digital and FB N
Stanley A Meyer Updated Digital and FB P

More Testing

Now that I have a working K14 (Feedback coil and Pulser Indicator Card) I when back to do some additional test looking at input to primary and output of Secondary. 

I followed the same test setup I used for the K14 testing:

I am using the K2 (M) output set to 41.67hz to drive all the gate and analog boards.

Gate is set to 50%

Analog signal level was set to be 2.32v anything less and the signal gets chopped.  If set higher there is addition noise in system that I was trying to avoid for this test.
Analog voltage offset and gain were also set to minimum levels.

I did set frequency to be 2khz and played around with gain and offset setting to see what they would do to input signal to Primary Coil.  I found that below 2v offset you can see the offset rise.  Once you go beyond 2 volts there is a change in the analog signal.  You begin to see what looks like what I initial though was noise.  First Picture below shows analog and digital signal below 2v.  The second show it slightly above 2v.  I used curse lines to provide level reference.  The additional signal is to the left of start gate pulse.

I did check the gate size and you can see in third and fourth pictures this additional sign is not affected by frequency.  I have also found that you can expand this signal to the left quickly by increasing the offset and slow by using gain control.   Gain control does not seem to have much effect if offset is below 2v.
I also wanted to see what the output of the secondary looks like I did this using same method I did for the feedback coil.  I put scope ground on system ground and probe on either S or F sides of coil.  You can see the results in next two photos.

I had notice in one of my earlier tests that when I was looking at secondary output that there was an additional pulse (actual sine wave) in the off pulse are.  The last two phots show it below 2v offset no pulses and above 2v the small additional pulses in off period.  I believe Ronnie stated that is part of the purpose of the offset so there always some pulses going to cells.

I had expected to see the rise in the analog peak signal level.  I did not expect the addition pulses.  Though if you slow things way down to can see the pulse and signal decay very clearly.

Stanley A Meyer Digital  and Analog vic
Stanley A Meyer Digital  and Analog vic
Stanley A Meyer Both sides of Secondary
Stanley A Meyer Digital and Analog Offse
Stanley A Meyer Digital vic and Secondar
Stanley A Meyer Vic Both sides of Second
Stanley A Meyer vic Digital and Secondar
Stanley A Meyer Digital and Analog vic O

Analysis and Test Results of Pulser Indicator K14

The attached pdf it the results of my testing of the Feedback coil and Stan's Pulse indicator circuit.  The two screen shots below shot 2 examples of what the output of K14 signal H input in K21.  The also show that the K14's output level does not change with frequency.

The test report also show the 2 feedback coil outputs and how they change going through K14.  This is a simple circuit  and it is a standard circuit for an Op Amp with a gain of 10, which is set by the resistors. The diodes ensure the proper voltage +/1 is place on the Op Amp input pins.  The rest of items on the output are there to drive the led.

The 5v offset is removed by the Op Amp and is there so the Op Amp does not require a negative power supply, instead ground is used.

The gain of 10 is need to raise voltage level to that needed by K21.  Note:  Level is not critical as long as it is high enough.  The important part of the signal is the phase information.

My testing also show that winding the coil with halve the wire, adding 5V to center, then winding other half is not a problem, this is what I did.  I believe you could also add 5v to center then wind both halves at same time.

As you can see in the pictures below the feedback coils track the digital pulses.

I do want to note:  I did not use all the VIC coils for this test  I just used the Primary and Feedback coils.  The secondary was on the core but not hooked up.  My main purpose was to see what the feedback coil output looked like and to see what K14 did to the signals.  I think the testing accomplished those goals.

One side benefit for me was that have feedback coil and K14 in the system made the output of K21 much more stable.  Some of this due the present of the feedback loop on the Op Amp in the circuit which helps to eliminate noise, again a standard function of this type of circuit.

I hope you're considering showing a closed loop signal test aswell which shows the feedback coil affecting the PLL (assuming you're using a PLL to lock in on and maintain a preset frequency) which then keeps track on the output frequency & timing as the electric properties of the cell changes alongside with gas forming in cell cavities, etc etc 

Actually I am using the PLL system to generate the digital signal I used to power the feedback coil and and the output of K14 provides the sync information into the K21.  This was the first time I could fully test the PLL part of K21 and I was able to change change frequencies in K21.  I am now playing with the offset and gain setting to see what they do. I did find one thing I did not expect the lock function quit working around 775hz.  I could see this using both manual and auto modes. I can see the frequency stays locked as you can see from screen shot above.

I will report more on offset and gain tests in my Vic from pieces thread I started those tests.  I still have a lot of work before I get to full cell tests.

Stanley a Meyer Pick up Coil feed back.p

I got thinking about pictures above and decided to capture Secondary output at faster rate so I could see actual wave form in side each gate pulse.   To do this I repositioned the two sides of the secondary on top of each other so the share a common center line.

 

 

  So the three pictures below are all at 2khz speed but with time scale changed.  First is 100us, second 500us and third 20ms. Grain is either below 2v or slightly above for these pictures I am not sure.  I just wanted to see more detail and what it looked like as I zoomed out. I believe in the 100us we are looking at a single digital pulse.

What you do not see in any of the screen shots is the whole wave bobbin up and down with the analog wave.  Wish I was more of an expert on analog signals.  I have always with digital stuff better even have a degree in computer science as a result as well as one in electrical engineering so I can understand things just did not practice it much more of a project engineer.

I thing my next step is to put a resister load on secondary just to see what changes.

One thing I have been looking for is where you increase the voltage in steps.  None of the controls I have seen so far seem to do that.  I know Ronnie at one point said changing frequency would give you high voltages.  I have been looking for that but have not seen it so far.

In all these there is no gap in core.  I did quickly try creating an air gap but it did not seem to do anything to secondary output.  However, gap was not between secondary and primary is was out side as I have not yet created brass spacers.  Will do that test again later as I want to see what changes.  I should see some change in secondary power level but not sure I will see phase change without cokes in system.

Secondary both sides merged 100us
Stanley A Meyer Vic Secondary both sides
Secondary both sides merged 500us 
Stanley A Meyer Vic Secondary both sides
Secondary both sides merged 20ms
Stanley A Meyer Vic Secondary both sides

If look at the last picture above, you should see a problem the digital pulse is on the falling part of the AM wave train not on the rising part. While I had noticed the digital pulses were on the falling edge of the AM wave, I had not thought to much about it at the time as I did not have all the circuits in place.  When I did the initial tests above, I was focused on levels, but I notice that the digital pulse were on wrong side again.  I woke this morning wonder why as I had used the same signal out of K2 to generated but the digital and AM wave trains.  If you look at K11 The Digital Control Means circuit it shows the same signal going to the K3, Gate Pulse Frequency Generator, and K8, Analog Voltage Generator.

However, if you look at K8’s circuit diagram the signal indicator above the M input show it to be on the falling edge.  After checking the M and M1 signals where the same I decided to do a quick test.  I went back to K2 and inverted the M signal going to K8.

The results are shown in the two pictures below, which are taken at the input to the Primary coil.  In both pictures the analog input is in blue and digital in yellow.
 
The first picture is with the M and M1 signals being identical and digital signal shows up on the falling part of the AM wave train.

The second picture is with the M signal inverted from M1. Now the Digital signal is on rising part the AM wave train where I expected to be.

The easiest why to fix this if you are using K11 is to use the M2 output for one of the signals as it is the inverse of M and M1.

In my case I will be using an inverter on my K2 board as that is the easiest place for me to do it and use that as my input to K8.

M input same as M1
Stanley A Meyer M input same as M1.JPG
M input inverse of M1
Stanley A Meyer M input inverse of M1.JP
After a lot of searching I found this signal in K8 means
"step pulsing negative"

Check Secondary output after fixing timing of input to K8. Picture below is another image of the merged output of secondary coil unloaded.  Image is clearer after apply fix.  You can see the amplitude of signal growing with each pulse now as digital signal moves up the AM signal.

Not sure what the best way to capture signals on secondary and or choke coils.  Image above is using system ground on ground of probes and probe on secondary output.

I have tried using one scope channel with ground on one side and probe on other.  Did get a similar signal but with higher voltage range.  Reason I tried that is one of the diagrams I have seen show secondary with one side tied to ground but it is not clear if that is same system ground or a floating ground.

Merged unloaded Sec Output.
Stanley A Meyer Merged unloaded Sec Outp

an a few more tests on output of secondary coil to better understand how to hook up scope for testing secondary side of VIC.
First, I tried using a 200-ohm resister as the load.  The digital pulse disappeared, and I could not get scope to sync.
Second tried a 200k-ohm resistor This removed the ringing on each pulse I will point it out below.  I am not sure what is correct load to use but I wanted to how signal out changed with load.  I am aware that impedance load will be different.
I also did some test on what happens when I change the position of the scopes ground.  The pictures above were all collected with the scope ground hooked to the system ground of the board.  There was some float in the signal that does not show up on screen shots.  After doing test below I double check one the screen shots above and float was there.
I did the following test using the analog signal as a reference.  I got the same results using digital signal as reference.
Test one:
CH1 – Yellow is analog input to primary, scope ground hooked to system ground
CH2 – Blue on load on secondary, GND of scope on S lead of secondary, and Probe on F lead
See first picture both signals are very stable

Test two:
Same connects but with 220k load
See second picture you can see that decay on signal in each pulse is gone but both signals are still stable

Test three:
Same setup but with scope ground for CH2 not hooked to anything
Note:  I get the same results with scope ground hooked up to system ground.
See third picture analog signal into primary is stable, but CH2 signal floats like on an AC signal.

Test four:
Same as test three setup but no load.

Comments: 
A resistive load reduces the ring in the delay pulse
Having the scope probe on system ground places a load on secondary output and reduce voltage level but does not seem to provide a stable reference for the output of the secondary at least as far as the scope is concerned. (Classic example of test equipment effecting equipment under test).

These screen shots all had the Scope GND probe on the S side of the Secondary when connected to Secondary output. If you switch it to the F side of secondary the Blue signal switches to the falling side of the AM signal.

Results is somewhat expected as the primary and secondary act like and isolation transformer where output is disconnected from the system earth ground on the primary side.  When this happens the ground source which the scope uses for timing is lost.

One of the VIC diagrams show a ground reference on the secondary side.  I believe this ground is not connected to the system ground on the primary side.  There is discussion of the “flowing” ground in some of the VIC threads which why I was doing these tests.  I wanted to understand impact of hooking up the scope.
The ground point is shown to be between the Secondary and the variable choke (side without the diode).  My question is can I continue to use my scope using this ground point or do I need a differential probe for my scope?

Aside note, I tried the 220-ohm resistor for a reason.  I want to see what it did to signal.  Nav in AM signal tread discusses using a 220-ohm resister as a load on system to maintain the flux level in core.  The high impedance is the load on the digital part of the see.  See his tread for detail.  He also states if system is tuned correct this load is not needed.

Tests to Capture Results of Changing Control Settings

I decided to capture what happens when I change control setting when I have my scope across the output of the secondary coil as this seems to be the most stable configuration.

So basic setup is as follows
K2 – output M1 is 41.67hz going to K3
K3 – is set for a 5% gate at 41.67hz
K2 – output M (is the inverse of M1) is going to K8
K8 – Idle offset was set to 2.32 voltage (minimum level with not clipping)
K21 – offset to be above 2v (like idle setting this seems be minimum setting)
I have CH2 probe on the output of the secondary and for this set of tests there is no other load on secondary.  Scope GND is on F side of secondary and probe on S side of Secondary.

What I am testing this series of test if the affect of changing the idle setting on K8.  I will be looking at the both the analog input into the Primary coil and the signal from the scope across the secondary coil.

As I have only 2 channels on my scope, I will redo the level changes so I can see result on both the primary analog input and the secondary output.
Capture the affect of changing K8 Idle Offset

As start of test Idle Offset will be approximate 2.32v (minimum setting in my system to get clean analog signal).
CH1 – Yellow is the output of K8, analog sign with offset (approx. 2v)
CH2- Blue is the scope probe across the Secondary Coil output (no load)
The first picture is with K8 set to the minimum idle setting approximate 2.32v
Note:  Vpp(2) value is 13.2V

Raise the Vmax(1) level to approx. 3V
Notice:  The output of the secondary voltage goes down Vpp(2) is not approx. 10 volts. I had seen this earlier when I was looking at the Primary inputs. 

Repeat this test but with CH1 scope on the Analog Input to the Primary Coil
First the Minimum Offset level
CH2-Blue on output of Secondary
CH1-Yellow is not on Analog input to Primary Coil
K8 setting are approx. the same as start of previous test
Notice both Vmax(1) and Vpp(2) will change

Capture the outputs with K8 Vmax about 3v
Notice that both Vmax (1) and Vpp(2) have dropped.  I expect them to be in sync and they are I can see them changing together when I change the idle offset value on K8.  Now I do not have a theory of why it works this way.  I had expected to see the values go up.  But this is the reason I am doing these test I want to know what will happen when I change a setting.

I plan on repeating these test but with changing the offset and gain on K9. One thing I have learned is you need to be careful and make sure you have the minimum values see correctly or system does not function the way you expect.  Get they too low and you signal disappears.  Happen to me several times when I turn wrong knob.

K8 normal Anal Pri and Sec S levels
Stanley A Meyer Vic  K8 normal Anal Pri
K8 idle raised Anal Pri and Sec S down
Stanley A Meyer Vic  K8 idle raised Anal
K8 idle raised Sec S
Stanley A Meyer Vic  K8 idle raised Sec
K8 normal level Sec S
Stanley A Meyer Vic K8 normal level Sec

I was looking ad differential probes last night and found I was close in seeing what the actual signal looks like out of secondary.  Turns out you can see what a differential probe will show you if you use 2 probes across the item you are measuring with both probes grounds on system ground.  Then if you use Math function A-B it will show you what a differential problem would.

So here are two screen shots showing unloaded secondary output and last one with 220K load

The first shows CH1, CH2 and the Math Function A-B where A is CH1 and B is CH2.

The second shows just the Math function with scale changed. Turns out you can turn off the display of the scope channels and Math function still works.  This is really what I was trying see as it gives you the real voltage of the output.  Bright spot on scope is light behind me forgot to block it.

Just to be complete I in last photo I added 220K load to secondary note voltage drop.

Secondary unload CH1 CH2 Math A-B 
Stanley A Meyer Vic Secondary unload CH1
Secondary unload output Math A-B  
Stanley A Meyer Vic Secondary unload out
Vic Secondary Math with load.
Stanley A Meyer Vic Secondary Math with

The following series of test show the result of increasing the offset on K9.

Test setup used the standard setup with the excepting I have set the Offset on K9 to be below minimum value so we can see what this looks like and what it looks like as we raise offset.
 
I did also check function of the Gain Pot on K9. I have not shown that here as it appears to be a fine control on the setting of the Offset Pot. So, for whatever value you set with the Offset it takes several turns of Gain trim pot to make a small change in output of secondary.

The scope pictures are from both probes on the secondary and using the math function A-B to create the same results you would get using a differential probe.  This is a truer picture of the voltage across the secondary.  I also have 220k resister across the secondary to provide some load.

Note:  I have turn off the display of CH1 A and CH2 B so we are only look at the results of the Math function.
Because I have only a 2-channel scope, I was not able to track the voltage level out into Primary during this test.

As Scope shots are all of the same connection I will not repeat set up as only change was to Offset on K9.
Picture 1 – Shows the signal when offset is set below 2v.  Purpose is to show what the signal looks like when offset is set too low
Picture 2 – Shows when offset is above 2v but not yet over minimum value. Note the sight curve in the base signal line.
Picture 3 – Shows when offset is over minimum value. The line is more curved and has a smooth arch.
Picture 4 – After raising offset more the curve in front of the digital pulses starts to flat as has some noise.  Flatten of the curve move left to right and continues to happen as you raise offset.
Picture 5 – As you continue to raise offset the voltage on the digital pulses also rises.  I also started to hear noise from the coils.
Picture 6 – You can easily see what I mean by curve flatting and easily see the rise in voltage in the digital pulses.
Picture 7 – The curve line is now almost completely flat, and you can see the digital pulses are starting to get clipped.
Picture 8 – No change in curved line but notice the digital pulse is now flat top and bottom and voltage no longer changes with rises in offset pot.

As a final check, I removed the inversion of the M signal into K8 so see what it would do output signal.  I could not see a difference it the output of secondary but that may be hid buy the Math function.

While I had done this test before I had done with using a differential probe setup which gives a truer voltage ready across a component so I had seen the affect of the offset pot when I did that test.

Vic Sec Out  1  Offset less than 2v 
Stanley A Meyer Vic Sec Out  1 Offs less
Vic Sec Out 2 slight more  than 2v 
Stanley A Meyer Vic Sec Out 2 slight mor
Vic Sec Out  3 over 2v   Min
Stanley A Meyer Vic Sec Out  3 over 2v M
Vic Sec Out 4 starting  starting to raise Offset
Stanley A Meyer Vic Sec Out 4 starting t

Rest of pictures
 

Sec Out 6 near top of Offset   
Stanley A Meyer Vic  Sec Out 6 near top
Sec Out 5 increasing Offset 
Stanley A Meyer Vic  Sec Out 5 inceasing
Sec Out 8 output clipped pulse flat 
Stanley A Meyer Vic Sec Out 8 output cli
Sec Out 7 stating to clip 
Stanley A Meyer Vic  Sec Out 7 stating t

After collecting the secondary output photos with two probes across output and using Scope Math function I decide to go back and do same offset and gain test but using the Input to the primary.  I have tried to do this test before but just with out proper load and did not get good results.  This time with both a Primary and Secondary Coil with 220k resister I got much better results of the AM wave.  This is to be expected as an AM amplifier reacts different loaded and unloaded.  The biggest difference is the Offset and Gain Pots now work properly.

These photos are important because this is what you word be seeing on the test jack on K9 which is the output to the VIC coils.  The photos are not at the exact same place as the Secondary phots but should be close especially those around the minimum offset value.

Turns out you can see what the gain function does in these photos better than in the Secondary output photos and I have a couple photos to show this. I took the Gain Photos first and labeled the G instead of P which why numbering starts with P4 but take about gain at end
.
Setup did not change from last set of photos above except the location of the scope probes which are now on the input to the primary coil. Both scope grounds are connected the system ground.

CH1 – yellow is the digital input frequency around 1.2khz for screen shots and my timing reference
CH2 – Blue is the analog input
P4 - I set both the offset pot and the gain pot setting to be near or below their minimum value.  The offset is well below as I wanted to see it change.
P5 – You can see the shape of the analog pulse start to change
P6 – I added cursors to show the amplitude of the pulse start to grow
P7- I raised the offset until amplitude stopped growing.  Note: At start of the cycle bottom slightly below the cursor.  Once it reaches the with cursor it changes.  At the point both AM and digital pulses start to move, AM whole wave trains starts to offset.  The digital pulse grows in amplitude.
P8 – Note Scope scale change.  This is at the point just before the top of the signal starts to get clipped.
P9 – AM Signal clipped at the top
P10 – As signal was going through be set to the minimum offset value I noticed that it slowly fills the spaces between the digital pulses.  This happens left to right and screen shot shows this with the space about half filled.
P11 – As the Math function was so important in understanding the output the secondary, I did take a look at.  This photo shows a typical value as it does not change much with either gain or offset changes so it not very useful here.  The other thing that this photo show is a different frequency.   I have the manual mode frequency set to 500hz and flipping that switch changes the pulse width but did not change much else on the screen.
G1 – With the offset it the middle range I played with the gain pot.  I added the cursers to top and bottom of the AM wave so I would have a baseline.
G2 – This is max gain, note the amplitude gain in the digital pulse as wee
G3 – This is just with gain just slightly above the minimum setting in the base line in G1.  With gain change is starts to change the amplitude of the signal first then as that increases so the offset.

I was really pleased with the results of these test as I can now see how offset and gain can be used to control the voltage going to primary.  This is what I had expected to happen but did not see as my earlier test did not provide enough load for the voltage to increase.
I still not sure what should be the minimum offset.  I would thing the value where the bottom of the AM signal in no longer clipped.

 Primary Input P4 Offset to low start to add AM wave
Stanley A Meyer VIC Primary Input P4 Off
 Primary Input P5 Offset to low no AM wave
Stanley A Meyer VIC  Primary Input P5 Of
Primary Input P6 Amplitude starting to grow.
Stanley A Meyer VIC  Primary Input P6 Am
Primary Input P7 Amplitude stops growing with Offset
Stanley A Meyer VIC  Primary Input P7 Am
Stanley A Meyer Vic Primary Input P8 Amp
Stanley A Meyer Vic Primary Input P9 Max
Stanley A Meyer Vic Primary Input P10 Cl
Primary Input P11 Math and growth between pulses.
Stanley A Meyer Vic Primary Input P11 Ma
Stanley A Meyer Vic Primary Input P10 Cl
Stanley A Meyer Vic Primary Input G1 No
Stanley A Meyer Vic Primary Input P9 Max

I did collect a series of screen shot where I captured both the primary input and secondary output at the same time so I have a record that I can check back against.  Operation system will have different value as loading will be different. 

 

They show as you increase the offset the voltage the signal across the secondary rises.  You can see that in photos above.  While doing that I was zoomed in so I was looking at data in one pulse.  It is interesting to watch the signals change as you raise the offset. 

 

You can see what I will call state changes where results change.  For example the analog signal stays pretty much at one level and signal expands horizontally then the offset starts to rise.

What I did find very difficult was to determine what voltage level the analog signal was at using this method as it jumps around allot.  I basically watch signal and estimated what the analog Vpp was.  Doing this was if I was going to try to repeat a value I most likely use Vmax of the digital pulses, while that moves around it is much more stable.

I sat and though about how Stan was doing this as method above is not repeatable.  He brought 2 signals out to the same test point so he could not be looking at both then the same time as you either can see the analog input to primary or the digital pulses.  The digital pulses gives the frequency and also some indication of a voltage; however, it does not tell you the analog voltage.  If you look at the analog voltage with no scope changes you will be able to see the analog signal and even the digital pulses in them but voltage level is jumping all over the place.

So I just did another test to see if I could get a more accurate estimate of the analog voltage Vpp value.  I turned off the digital input and only looked at the analog signal.  I then zoomed way out and looked at signal Vpp and increase the scale factor to 10.  This reduced the noise on the signal and while it take several seconds for the screen to update the Vpp value that I get is much easier to see as it stay stable for several second.  I then adjusted value and waited several screen updates until I was happy with value I was getting.  With this method I believe I can get repeatable results.

Picture below so the results of me trying to set Vpp to 10v.

Note:  It is very possible that I have noise in my test system that should not be in a production system or even on prototype boards. You will not get these if you just build the circuits, and that is what I did, you most likely will have left out filter capacitors that get added as standard practice.  i.e. power filters to supplies for the IC.

Having said that, my test boards work well enough that I can configure my system and they have giving me a working understanding of what each of the front panel controls do.  I am still not done as things change as you add more pieces.  I really saw that when I added a load to the secondary.  While load is still not correct with no load the offset and gain on K9 did not appear to do anything.

My next step was to play with the gap in the cores to see what it did to signals.  I did find a reference that for a standard transformer is only has an effect if the transformer is saturated.  Not our case,  gaps with inductors are another issue and this was the last statement article.

" Hope you will be clear by this time that as our magnetizing currents are very low it is safe to go without any air gap. But you may be seeing few applications using air gap in transformers. Here the main purpose is to play with the magnetizing inductance so that can control the leakage inductance for critical applications like DAB/Resonant converters."

So it is beginning to look like I need to build the chokes before those these will work.

 

Analog input to primary zoomed to compress signal.
Stanley A Meyer Vic Analog input to prim

I did another set of tests only this time I left the analog signal fixed and only changed the digital frequency.  I tested from 1khz to 5khz in 500hz steps.  Setup was the same at the above test.  I attached the results in the attached pdf.  It includes screens shots at each frequency plus a few showing what happens when you change the switch settings 1x,2x,3x,4x on VIC board.  Test detail is included in the document.

First picture in each set show the digital frequency going into the primary coil.  This is zoomed in so I can get a close estimate of actual frequency.  Second picture show output of Secondary.  Item of main interest is the Math function which is the actual voltage output of the secondary.  CH1 and CH2 are the S and F outputs of the Secondary to the 220k resistor load, both scope leads are connected to system ground.  The math function is what you would see if you used a differential probe.

Quick test summary,  It appears that changing only the frequency just changes the number of pulses in each gate pulse. This will increase the energy density in each pulse but not the voltage level.  You can see this by looking at the Math function output in the screen shots.

I put VIC coils all together in my VIC jig and repeated the inductance meter meter measurements with no gap, 0.004th on coke leg and with 0.004th on both legs. 

 

The chokes and secondary were not connect to anything but meter. 

Goal was to see what gap did to the coils. 

Simple answer is gap reduces the coils inductance. 

I have attached the measurements I took for my coils. 

 

The hz reading is from the meter and it tells you what the frequency was used to calculate henrys.  I plan on doing some smaller gap changes I just decide to start with .004 spacer I also have .006, .002, .001 and believe smallest is .0005. 

 

As you can see in the table a change in the gap affects all three coils.  For some of the coils the meter cycled between two values so I include both.  The only change to setup was to add the brass spacer. 

 

I did not change and of the coil windings or make a changes to wire resistance though I know what those values are for all three coils.

For reference I also include Z for each coil at 1khz.  Once you know the H value for coil Z=2*pi*f*L.

Not sure if this is the best way to go about this but it was easy to collect this data at this point as I have not yet hooked the coils up.
Having 2 spacers put the primary and C2 one one core piece and secondary and C1 on the other. 

One of the things we were told to do early on was to impedance balance the system but to do that you needed to know the coils inductance and the cells capacitance and we had neither of the values. 

 

This is my attempt to at least know one of them and to get a feel for what one change (the gap) does to the systems does. 

 

I am aware the gap also changes the phase of the system signal and I plan on looking at that later.

Stanley A Meyer Change in inductance due

I put .001th shim on Choke side of core and redid measurements in this case inductance went up but that may be caused by the whole system being connected tighter and not do to the  additional shim. 

 

I also added a column showing the difference in Henrys and Z for each change for reference. 

 

One thing that is very apparent is this as not a linear function especially going from no gap to .004 gap as adding an additional .004 on other leg had a much smaller effect. 

 

Much easier to see when you look at the change in Z.  One exception to this was there was a big change in the difference for the second with the addition of the .004 in that leg

Another thing that you can see is amount of change on C1 and C2 is different for each change I expect this is why gap change be used to adjust the phase.

Stanley A Meyer Change in inductance due

I hooked up the Diode and C1 and C2 to 3 resistors that add up to 76.65 ohms (no cells or capacitors at this point).  This is close to the Re 78.54 of the cells. 

 

I then captured a couple of screen shots to see what the signal looks like at the cell interface in this case across the resistors.  Picture P1 shows the signal.  Turns out the big difference in the C1 and C2 signals and the large math function are because I had hooked up the connections to C1 backwards. 

 

 Picture P2 show the signals when cell is turned off as I wanted to see the base carrier you get there is no system ground in signal.  Notice scope scales. 

 

I had correct diagram show correct way but after hooking but C2 I just did the same for C1 which is wrong.

Pictures P3 and P4 are signals when C1 is hooked up correctly.  I reversed the probes between taking these pictures and got the same results. 

 

Note:  Scales are now equal for all three signals.

I did not capture the cell off picture with C1 hooked correctly but the signal where at the same level in that case.

Note:  All these tests where done with low offset and frequency at 1K.

Final picture is my test setup.

I also measured the voltage across resistor and on each side of the resistor with one side of meter connected to system ground. 

 

I am trying to figure out how to measure the voltage differential going to the cell which should be 1.23 volts.

DC voltage across resistor is .027
AC voltage across resistor is .024
DC voltage on C1 to ground is 0.0
AC voltage on C1 side to ground is 1.189 to 1.198
DC voltage on C2 to ground is 0.0
AC voltage on C2 side to ground is 1.193 to 1.204
Note:  C2 is 69 ohms and C1 is 77.7 ohms with 10’ on external air core.

I was hoping I could see the voltage difference with just the resistor as this would be the starting point when conditioning cell when capacitor is full of water and is basically shorted. 

 

Given the slight difference between the C1 and C2 sides it does not look like this is working without the capacitor in circuit.

 

I am also not sure the best way to make the measurement. 

I am under the impression that the voltage difference should be constant across frequency based on Ronnie’s comments.

Stanley A Meyer  Vic under test C1 backw
P1 Picture 1 below
Stanley A Meyer P1 Signal with C1 Connec
P2 Picture 2 below
Stanley A Meyer  P2 Sigal with Cell turn
P3 Picture 3 below
Stanley A Meyer  P3 Signal across R Prob
P4 Picture 4 below
Stanley A Meyer  P4 Signal across Resist

Added capacitor in series with resistors:  Cap labeled 8.20uF +/-5% 630VDC measured 7.76uF with my meter.  Note: this is a nondirectional capacitor.

Probes in photos – Probe grounds are connected to system ground
C1 – Yellow is on C1 minus side of Cap
C2 – Bule is on C2 plus side of Cap
Math is A-B where A is C1 and B is C2

What I was trying to do in this series of tests was to see the effect of the capacitor on signal and the best way to measure signal and voltage difference between the two side of the capacitor.  I did see a big change in voltage after adding capacitor and could see it charge up.  I also found that putting a voltmeter across the cap caused a voltage drop of slightly over a quarter of a volt.

Picture PC1 shows a couple of things.  C2 blue show the state of the signal when the cell is turned off by switch. Note the offset is zero I was attempting to measure this using the cursors. One other thing to note is that CH1 probe was set incorrectly.  Probe was 1x instead of 10x, I have had this happen to me before so while I checked it, I did not look close enough.  It was fixed in last 2 pictures
.
Picture PC2 shows same setting with cell turned back on and you can see voltage offset to C2 interesting C1 does not move.

Picture PC3 shows the same signal zoomed in closer.

Pictures PC4 and PC5 have the probe setting fixed on C1 and signal now looks more like the results on the resistors only. In both these pictures voltmeter is not connected.

In PC4 I have turned on the AVG function for voltage on both Channels so I could estimate the voltage difference be the two sides of the cap.

In PC5 I did the same thing but used RMS function.

While the both had slightly different results the difference when you subtract them was only .01v so this these functions may be the way I measure the voltage difference across cells so I can set the required 1.23v difference. I am still not sure this will work will watch this in future tests.

Also note in both PC4 and PC5 you can see a DC voltage offset of about 4 volts to both CH2 and the Math function.  Note:  I do have both probes couple selection set to DC.  I do not thing this is the difference we are trying to set as this value changes with the level of the charge on the cell.  I saw this a I watch the cell discharge both on voltmeter and on scope C2 to level shown in picture PC1.

I also took a couple of measurements with voltmeter. Voltage across cell was 3.75 as noted above I could see voltage drop to this level when I hooked up meter.  Voltage on plus side of cell with negative side of meter hooked to system ground was 3.16vdc and on negative side of capacitor it was -.33vdc.

One final note other than turning cell off and on with switch I did not make any other changes to my test system configuration.  As with above resistor tests the frequency was still set to 1khz and minimum offset to analog signal.

Now that I have a baseline, next step is to slowly start to change things one at time to see what happens.

One thing I did not see was the frequency doubling. Will look for this more when I start change system configuration.  One of the first things I will check is to reverse diode as I can do that easily as I have not soldered my connections yet.  It is also possible I have the wrong diode and/or capacitor type.

PC1 Picture 1 below
Stanley A Meyer PC1 Cell Connect will Ca
PC2 Picture 2 below
Stanley A Meyer  PC2 Cell with Cap Probe
PC3 Picture 3 below
Stanley A Meyer  PC3 Curse added to show
PC4 Picture 4 below
Stanley A Meyer PC4 Signal at cell  Avg.
PC5 Picture 5 below
Stanley A Meyer PC5 signal at cell RMS.J

My testing showed that it needs to 1K or input will be to low to trigger Q6.   Fix should be easy as traces are correct we just need to change silk screen for resistor to 1K.

I also have a circuit schematic for K4 section, I not sure by who but Revision history give Initial release date 2011-11-16 and revision of 2016-12-15 that show part being changed to 1K.    (Looks like it was part of a larger schematic for VIC ?)

Note:  It also says 1N4005 should be 1N4003.

K4 schematic section with 1K problem.JPG

 realize while path is correct directions on arrows on F is wrong.  As signal goes out S and comes back on F.  But as we are dealing with an analog signal not sure arrows matter.

It is amazing how 4 lines can get so complicated. 

 

Much cleaner on the schematic when you have diodes next to Primary coil.  see picture. 

Should have posted this earlier I think it you have helped.  (By the Q9 in schematic is Q3 on board).

Stanley A Meyer VIC connections schematic

I also did some initial testing of the Patch that was in the middle of the board on my tests system.  It puts the digital signal on the analog side of the primary.  The digital signal rides on top of the analog signal. 

 

Still need to do some more testing as I did not have the capacitor in test setup that ties signal to ground so result was near 12V.  Signal is in sync with the digital pulses, this I expected as it generated from same source. 

 

So it not in Gate off area.  Only thing there is the analog signal.

Patches on Stan’s VIC board.

While helping document the VIC board, I learned more about one of the Patches on Stan’s VIC board.  I do not have that patch in my test systems as I build all my boards from schematics, so they are not an exact duplicated of Stan’s VIC.

I could see where the patch was connected but I wanted to see what it does to the signals.

  It turns it is pretty easy to install patch on by test setup as I used screw connectors and have easy access to multiple points on the board including the ones used in the patch.

The patch hooks up to the 4x switch position “1X” (which comes from pin 4 of the 4046 chip).

This signal is the high frequency digital signal and contains the gate.

Patch runs from 1x to a 22K resistor connected to ground through 0.22uF capacitor, capacitor is on the same side as the input.  The output of the resistor is connected, to PRI-S on the input side of the diode 1N5408, which places it between the Primary coil and diode.

In my test system I hooked up the capacitor and resistor with a couple of patch cords to do test so I could add it and remove it easily so I could see what changes.

Test setup.  I have a baseline frequency and gate of 41.67hz which is also the baseline analog frequency.

Gate is set to 50% duty cycle.  The offset and gain is set to minimum levels that I have been using for most of testing.  Frequency to the digital signal is set to 1khz and did not change any of these value during the tests.

For initial test I have scope probe inputs set to DC offset.
CH1- Yellow it the digital side of primary F+
CH2- Bule is the analog side of primary S-

Picture 1 show the input to the primary without the patch and is what I typical see for these settings.  I have set levels to 1V for both sides so you can see the ramp on the analog channels.


Picture 2 is with the patch hooked up.  No other changes I wanted to show ramp on analog signal is still there.  (Hard to see on high scale setting on the scope).


Picture 3 is the same as picture 2 with scope scale set to 5V for both channels no other changes.


Picture 4 is the same as picture 2 but zoomed in


Picture 5 is the same as picture 2 but zoomed in even closer


Picture 6 I did not change setup but did put my differential Probe on CH2 scope probe is set to 100 but probe is 200 so reading off by a factor of 2.  I want to show what signal to cell looks like.

  This is without patch.  CH1 is still hooked to primary input and provide scope sync reference.


Picture 7 same setting as picture 6 but with patch installed.  Notice that the signal across cell does not appear to change.


Picture 8 is the same as P7 but zoomed in.

One other thing I noticed is the lock light was now flickering when it was not before.

he large signal you see on both side of primary in picture 2 with the patch in place will get substracted as it appears on both sides which is why you do not see a change in the signal to the cells in pictures 7 and 8.

I will have to see what this will do being able to watch offset in analog signal to determine. Voltage level into primary 2-11V.  I did not look at that as I was just trying to see what patch did to signals.

P1 VIC Patch Test no Patch.png
P2 VIC  Patch Test Patch Installed no ch
P3 Same as P2 with scope scale changed t
P4 Zoomed in version of P3.png
P5 Zoomed P3 even closer.png
P6 No Patch - with Diff Probe on cell in
P7 Patch with Diff Probe on Cell Input.p
P8 same as P7 zoomed in.png

The large signal you see on both side of primary in picture 2 with the patch in place will get substracted as it appears on both sides which is why you do not see a change in the signal to the cells in pictures 7 and 8.

I will have to see what this will do being able to watch offset in analog signal to determine. Voltage level into primary 2-11V.  I did not look at that as I was just trying to see what patch did to signals.

I installed a smaller sized capacitor not sure of voltage but the capacitor I used above the was 100V as that is all I thought I had.  But check this morning as I had purchased a box of small ceramic caps and it had some .33uf so installed one and got this results.  Wondered about this as picture of board had a small capacitor.  You can see difference in shape in this close in view.

Vic Stan Meyer P9 Patch with small voltage CAP

Patch Notes

I may have found another error on VIC board based on testing of Patch.   I like the patch it makes sense to me.  What does not is the the [H] signal from TS2 near center of board going to center pin of Analog switch as the way that switch is wired it will be put across
the side of the of the primary coil select by the switch.  Does not do much to digital signal but when I put it across analog side of coil the analog signal disappeared.

I tried to trace where it went on picture of original board but it is hard to see.  Instead of going right to test point it goes left and I do not  what the pins are.  Some of the front panel landing pads have been moved on our layout from where they where on original board.

This bother me which why I tested it.  Initial thought if would be another position on the switch but the way we have on traces it is always hooked up.

Still trying to figure out where it actually goes.

I think I have it traced.  It goes to SW2 landing pad side nearest center and in does not appear to be connected to anything unless there is a solder trace in the Pad I can not see.

If you look at picture of board with front panel remove you can see SW2 landing pad clearly and there is no connection to left pad where Signal H terminates.

If that is the case we need to remove the trace from [H] going to switch.

I fill put traces in a work document at post so you can see what I am talking about as that will be fastest why for me.  So I did not catch this before even though it puzzles me.

While testing patch I also tested to see what would happen to signal the way Anal/Freq switch is wired as it bothered me that [H] goes to center pin which means it is always connected.  Problem is when switch selects either Pri S or Pri H it is still connected which means it is also connected to primary.  Did not do much to digital signal but wiped out analog part of analog signal.

Attached document show actually routing of [H] based on pictures of Stan's board.  Looks like it should not be connected to anything. I will also post picture here showing what I mean.   Based of those pictures [H] go SW2 pad near center of board but that is not connected to anything. Fix is to remove part of the trace on your VIC board.  I also show where that can be done.

Stanley A Meyer Vic Patch Notes
Stanley A Meyer Vic Patch Notes
Stanley A Meyer Vic Patch Notes
Stanley A Meyer Vic Patch Notes

Patch Bom note 

One other note:  Most likely for BOM is that the 0.33uF for the patch needs to a small one.  When I first tried the patch on my test system I used a 100V 0.33uF capacitor and it distorts the signal too much.  I found a smaller ceramic capacitor and got much better results.  Do not know voltage level as it is from a box of small capacitors and it did not specify the voltage.  I have posted picture showing difference.

 I purchased these on Amazon for $10.

No voltage level specified.  The one in picture of Stan's board was green and not large one one.

I have made similar purchases like this for other parts.  Found one that had all the diodes I needed for VIC board, and box for trim resistors.  Box is offend only a few dollars more than just a few items of one type.

Cap assortment.png
Capacitor location being discussed above
WhatsApp Image 2021-01-22 at 02.07.01.jp

I am continuing to get the VIC card I have ready for testing so I can verify it works.  I have made all the changes we found so far.  I have also build a front panel and wired it to the board.  I left the connecting wires a little long on purpose so I have room to move things around and also if I want to reuse front panel with another card.

I am still missing a few capacitors on the board they are on order and should be here in a week.

I am using a 5 amp circuit breaker instead of a fuse.   Only thing I noticed if there is 5 AMP on circuit wire to fuse and VAR switch should be heavier and that would require larger landing pads on VIC board for these 2 items.

Next step will be to mount the panel and decide where the daughter board will be located so I can they wire it to VIC card.  Need to know wire length before wiring. I may use connectors between boards to make easier to work on them if I need to make any changes.

The table we created for merging the boards will be a big help in wiring the VIC and daughter boards together.

Stanley A Meyer VIC Front Pannel Wired Front.png
Stanley A Meyer VIC Front Pannel Wired Back .png

Vic Cell Gas Feed Back Pressure Sensor Signal 

While hooking at what it takes to hook up the card above I was reviewing interfaces and I beginning to think we may have 2 different [G] signals in the system and they should NOT be connected.   We did that in recent VIC Matrix board upgrade.  The [G] on pin 17 should not be connected to anything off the VIC board to avoid problems.  If anything it should just go to a terminal block.

Reasons
[G] on Vic board is generated in K21 and is the combined gate and High frequency digital signal.  It goes to K4 to get amplified then onto coils.  Most likely put it on the output PIN in case it was needed.  Easier to not use it than put trace in if it was needed.

The [G] already on the Vic Matrix board was generated in K2 and is the low frequency reference signal (less that 75hz) that goes to the Digital Means card K11.    K11 then changes the signal slightly and send it to both K3 and K8, this signal must be low frequency for system to work.

So this means these 2 signal cannot be connected together.

Test of the effect of OFFET and Idle Adjust on Primary and Cell Interface

This series looks at what happens to [J] if signal provided to K9 Voltage Amplitude Control is at an offset level. 

 

I have been working with Dan on a version of the VIC card that has a 741 that receives a signal to increase gas production (input from GAS FEEDBACK).  Based on where this signal is injected into VIC my speculation is that it is signal based on J but at a higher voltage level (offset). 

 

As I have not built the Gas Feedback card, I have no way to verify this.  However, I do have a way to increase the energy level (offset) of [J].  I did this by raising the offset by using the Idle control on K8, Analog Voltage Generator. 

 

The series of picture below show the results of these tests.

Initial conditions, I started with the same basic minimum conditions I have been using for most of the testing I did above.  Analog signal 41.67hz, Digital frequency 1khz, analog signal offset in K8 just above minimum level around 2.32v, offset and gain in K9 set to give signal in picture 1 below.

One thing that is different is I now have the patch in system that provides the digital signal to the analog side of input to Primary.
Test of this patch are shown in prior post.

CH1 – yellow is on Digital side of input to Primary Coil F+
CH2 – Blue is on the Analog side of input to Primary Coil S-

Picture 1 -Shows initial conditions set above.  I had set Offset and Gain to fill the spaces in-between the pulses.

Picture 2 - I raised the Idle Offset on K8.  Notice the fill between pulse is gone and those in space are also reduced. I stopped raising level to leave some of the fill in the space.

Picture 3 – I raised the Idle Offset on K8 some more and the fill is now gone.  I did change setting on scope to better show that the AM wave is still there as it is harder to see at higher scale settings.

Picture 4 – I raised the OFFSET on K9 and the fill returned.
At this point I wanted to see what this was doing to the signal on the cell interface.  So, I reconfigure system to initial conditions and change scope setup.

As digital signal was not changing, I move channel one to analog side and put my differential probe on channel 2 (reading off by factor of 2).  CH2 is now on cell interface.  The advantage of using the analog channel is with patch installed you can now see both the analog and digital signal and even the fill.

CH1 – Yellow    Analog input to Primary Coil
CH2 – Blue        Signal across the Cell interface

Picture 5 - Shows the initial conditions for this configuration. Your can see the fill in-between pulses.

Picture 6 – I raised the Idle Offset on K8 and fill is gone and the signal on Cell Interface flattened.

Picture 7 – I raised the Offset on K9 and fill returned and signal regained ramp.

I am still not sure what the setting needs to be. 

 

I am still trying to see how the signal changes when system controls are changed. 

In operations both these controls will have been set to some minimum value and then locked. 

 

 I expect that same will apply to the Gain Control on K9. At this point, I do know if I just raise the OFFSET on K9 the fill does not disappear.  I can also verify that voltage to primary does not start to raise until the space between the pulses is filled.

 

I did not try to adjust the gain for this series as I wanted to keep down the number of things being changed

NOTE:  I am using a capacitor with a resistor in series to simulate cell for all the above tests.

One conclusion I can made. The patch is a big help as you can see what is happening on one channel of the scope. 

This is important as the test point on the VIC front panel only show one side of the primary input at a time.

 

  In the analog signal you can now see the gate, the digital frequency, the analog signal and voltage level of the analog signal though that is harder to determine. 


For this series, I cheated and had put a voltmeter across the input to the OFFSET so I could easily reset it to my known minimum level.  It also let me see what level I was setting it to as I changed it. 

 

Did this as I have been having a hard time finding a scope reading for analog signal that stable enough to give an accurate reading for this value. 

 P1 Initial configuration 

Stanley A Meyer Vic  P1 Initial configuration

P2 Idle Adjustment

P2 Idle Adjustment.png

P3 Idle Raised More 

P3 Idle Raised More.png

P4 Raised Offset

P4  Raised Offset.png

P5 Cell Interface Initial Conditions 

P5 Cell Interface Initial Conditions.png

P6 Raised Idle

P6 Raised Idle.png

P7 Raised Offset

P7 Raised Offset.png
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